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Most overrated BBers of all time

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  • #31
    Originally posted by preist943
    yes it does and thats why arnold won . dont get me wrong Serge was great but come on ,when he faced off arnold at the O he was 6ft 200p did you hear that? 6ft 200 arnold was 230 ! he was the freak of that time . I mean really im 5ft8 and 210 serge looks great in pics but next to the big boys he looked like a kid . 17in arms ? whats that and arnolds legs looked like platz next to him . and talk about no calves sergio nor serge even looked like the trained them . 7 time MR.O over rated lol
    yeah arnold's lats come way down.

    17 inch arms, I've got 17 inch arms.
    People say: "Never say Never".

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by capnkid
      yeah arnold's lats come way down.

      17 inch arms, I've got 17 inch arms.
      yep thats what serge had at the O

      Comment


      • #33
        Chris Cook is a bit overrated. The guy has done nothing with his pro card since he got his status.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by tu_holmes
          Personally, I always like Serge and I honestly would not have had an issue of him winning at the time, especially in the mid 70s...

          However, it's not just ONE thing... you say Serge was ripped, or Sergio had bigger this, or smaller that, but it's the ENTIRE body that is judged... not just one aspect of it... Also, look at them on stage, at that moment, and often, Arnold stole the show... No, maybe he didn't always have the best body, but he presented the best at that moment.... and that's when it counts.

          Again, I'm not an Arnold freak... I think he's done a lot for the sport, but there are obviously people I would rather look like... Sergio and Serge are two of them.
          If you're talking about ENTIRE body then that's where Arnold looses. He did'nt present his body better than other BBers at all. Arnold had a few poses in wich he struck all the time. The man never did tricep poses. He never did a rear lat spread on stage. You can count the number of times he struck an unrequested front lat spred in his career on one hand. His straight arm poses were an eye sore (wich is why he only did them on request). He had the same ol routine everytime he got on stage. Arnold even said himself.... when you're constantly doing poses to hide your weaknesses it can sometimes work against you by calling the judges attention to what you're trying to hide. But seeing that Weider paid for Arnolds trip to the states, put him in an apartment and gave him a weekly salery..>Arnold was an investment.. he had money in Arnold and his weaknesses were pardoned. Arnold was set to be Mr O before he even came to the states. Weider implyed that he had a hard time marketing Sergio as Mr O at that time. Arnold had charm, a look and a charactor....That was a different era that today and back then was a time where a white Mr. O with those qualities simply got better marketing.
          No way did Arnold present his body better than Sergio. Sergio did countless poses that Arnold would not dare to do on stage. Straight arm poses, arms over head (wich was also done by Larry Scott, and wich was largely a forearm pose..something that Arnold lacked), rear lat spreads, tricep poses. Arnold admited to avoiding a abdominal pose with Franco and a lat spread with Sergio. Arnold was a coward on stage and he ran from BBers challeneges to do some more of his everyday bicep poses. He did not present his body the best on stage... that is a lie.

          That was not the era of freaks. Shape mattered in those days more than anything and Arnold was not the best. Even if you're going to talk about mass... as I said before, Arnold was a about 4 inches taller than sergio and yet they both weighed the same with Sergio being slighty heavier at times (Sergio at 240 on average give or take a couple pounds)...thus he carried more muscle mass on his frame than Arnold in the same way Gunter is bigger than Ronnie, but Ronnie carries more mass for his givin frame.

          You find countless people (the vast majority) saying Arnold was the best of all time. If you got people saying that Serge Nubret & Sergio was better than Arnold, and yet Serge 7 Sergio are chosen much less as being the best of all time then Arnold is being overrated. I know he had a chest, biceps and he could do a bunch of twisting poses to make his body look less flawed, but as I explained... he was not the best of his era, nor was he the best of all time.

          p.s By 1975 Serge carried more mass on his per frame than Arnold easily (as Arnold even implied himself). This was not the Ronnie coleman era and even if it was, givin that fact of mass per frame, Arnold still should have went down just like Dexter knockes the he!l out of BBers bigger than him. But I'm sure people will always worshop Arnold and his terminator image like a god. Rest assured that all Arnold maniacs who hold him as the greatest of his era or the g.o.a.t. are dilusional.
          Last edited by encarta; October 22nd, 2006, 02:35 PM.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by encarta
            Weider implyed that he had a hard time marketing Sergio as Mr O at that time. Arnold had charm, a look and a charactor....That was a different era that today and back then was a time where a white Mr. O with those qualities simply got better marketing.


            No way did Arnold present his body better than Sergio. Sergio did countless poses that Arnold would not dare to do on stage. Straight arm poses, arms over head (wich was also done by Larry Scott, and wich was largely a forearm pose..something that Arnold lacked), rear lat spreads, tricep poses. Arnold admited to avoiding a abdominal pose with Franco and a lat spread with Sergio. Arnold was a coward on stage and he ran from BBers challeneges to do some more of his everyday bicep poses. He did not present his body the best on stage... that is a lie.
            Charm and character are all part of the stage presence... His personality came out on stage, that's what stage presence is. Knowing what poses to do and what poses not to do is all part of the knowing your limits and working within them to get the win, that IS the stage aspect of bodybuilding period.

            Of course you will disagree and that's fine, it's certainly your right... but at the time, and often today, more people believe Arnold was certainly the best on most of those days.

            You may disagree, and I may agree with you, but history is written by majority, not minority.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by tu_holmes
              I'm going to simply agree on all statements above. (Except Lee Labrada... I actually thought he had a really good total package)
              I agree he had the total package, and excellent proportion, I just thought he needed a bit more size to be as good as his hype.

              Comment


              • #37
                Arnold is overated as a "person".. As a BB'er he is a legend.

                Comment


                • #38
                  All of our Olympia champs were great in their time. They were also, at times, over rated during their rein. There should have been several other Mr. Olympias over the last 43 years than the just the 11 that stand. Shawn Ray, Flex Wheeler, Kevin Laverone, Rich Gaspari, probably a couple of others, should also hold the title right now because the incumbent was over rated. I don’t think that’s going to happen anymore.

                  This is going to be a very different era of bodybuilding.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by encarta
                    If you're talking about ENTIRE body then that's where Arnold looses. He did'nt present his body better than other BBers at all. Arnold had a few poses in wich he struck all the time. The man never did tricep poses. He never did a rear lat spread on stage. You can count the number of times he struck an unrequested front lat spred in his career on one hand. His straight arm poses were an eye sore (wich is why he only did them on request). He had the same ol routine everytime he got on stage. Arnold even said himself.... when you're constantly doing poses to hide your weaknesses it can sometimes work against you by calling the judges attention to what you're trying to hide. But seeing that Weider paid for Arnolds trip to the states, put him in an apartment and gave him a weekly salery..>Arnold was an investment.. he had money in Arnold and his weaknesses were pardoned. Arnold was set to be Mr O before he even came to the states. Weider implyed that he had a hard time marketing Sergio as Mr O at that time. Arnold had charm, a look and a charactor....That was a different era that today and back then was a time where a white Mr. O with those qualities simply got better marketing.
                    No way did Arnold present his body better than Sergio. Sergio did countless poses that Arnold would not dare to do on stage. Straight arm poses, arms over head (wich was also done by Larry Scott, and wich was largely a forearm pose..something that Arnold lacked), rear lat spreads, tricep poses. Arnold admited to avoiding a abdominal pose with Franco and a lat spread with Sergio. Arnold was a coward on stage and he ran from BBers challeneges to do some more of his everyday bicep poses. He did not present his body the best on stage... that is a lie.

                    That was not the era of freaks. Shape mattered in those days more than anything and Arnold was not the best. Even if you're going to talk about mass... as I said before, Arnold was a about 4 inches taller than sergio and yet they both weighed the same with Sergio being slighty heavier at times (Sergio at 240 on average give or take a couple pounds)...thus he carried more muscle mass on his frame than Arnold in the same way Gunter is bigger than Ronnie, but Ronnie carries more mass for his givin frame.

                    You find countless people (the vast majority) saying Arnold was the best of all time. If you got people saying that Serge Nubret & Sergio was better than Arnold, and yet Serge 7 Sergio are chosen much less as being the best of all time then Arnold is being overrated. I know he had a chest, biceps and he could do a bunch of twisting poses to make his body look less flawed, but as I explained... he was not the best of his era, nor was he the best of all time.

                    p.s By 1975 Serge carried more mass on his per frame than Arnold easily (as Arnold even implied himself). This was not the Ronnie coleman era and even if it was, givin that fact of mass per frame, Arnold still should have went down just like Dexter knockes the he!l out of BBers bigger than him. But I'm sure people will always worshop Arnold and his terminator image like a god. Rest assured that all Arnold maniacs who hold him as the greatest of his era or the g.o.a.t. are dilusional.
                    When it comes down to it, they were all standing on the same stage,doing the same poses, and the judges gave the best man on stage the Olympia. And that was Arnold! Sorry

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      I agree. Jay probably can't hold onto a Ronnie type of domination for even 2 years with the new blood coming up. Victor, Dexter, Gustavo, etc all could take Jay out on their best day. Jay also may be training with his own future undoer Phil Heath if Phil adds the muscle and width. Not to mention Ronnie is not down for the count. A healed up, driven Ronnie Coleman even at 90% of his best is the most dangerous phenomenon (yes I said phenomenon) in pro bodybuilding.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by John Romano
                        All of our Olympia champs were great in their time. They were also, at times, over rated during their rein. There should have been several other Mr. Olympias over the last 43 years than the just the 11 that stand. Shawn Ray, Flex Wheeler, Kevin Laverone, Rich Gaspari, probably a couple of others, should also hold the title right now because the incumbent was over rated. I donít think thatís going to happen anymore.

                        This is going to be a very different era of bodybuilding.
                        I think you are 100% right JR on this new era. I also love the old school shots of Arnold, Nubret and Sergio, thanks!

                        The most over rated pro : Victor Richards. Hyped to the be the next great, multi Mr O annd he never even got into a pro contest.
                        The guy never evens takes to the pro stage, if that is not being OVER rated, what is?
                        I saw a star, reached for it...and MISSED

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by John Romano
                          All of our Olympia champs were great in their time. They were also, at times, over rated during their rein. There should have been several other Mr. Olympias over the last 43 years than the just the 11 that stand. Shawn Ray, Flex Wheeler, Kevin Laverone, Rich Gaspari, probably a couple of others, should also hold the title right now because the incumbent was over rated. I donít think thatís going to happen anymore.

                          This is going to be a very different era of bodybuilding.


                          Goddam I hope it changes... I'm tired of guys getting the shaft just because they like the guy who won it the year before.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            I agree with John Romano but who are we to judge these guys unless we are at their level and feel we were robbed competing against them. Also remember just like many other things in life money and politics drive the industry not the votes of who joe shmoe feels is better.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by BillyGuns.com
                              I agree with John Romano but who are we to judge these guys unless we are at their level and feel we were robbed competing against them. Also remember just like many other things in life money and politics drive the industry not the votes of who joe shmoe feels is better.

                              Who are we?

                              We're the fans... we're the guys buying the mags, buying the tickets, and buying the supplements... without us, there is NO bodybuidling, period.

                              We have every right to question the outcome of contests... we're the ones buying it, and since it's not a sport where the people playing decide who wins (ie, on the field) I think it's also our duty to question those outcomes.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by John Romano
                                All of our Olympia champs were great in their time. They were also, at times, over rated during their rein. There should have been several other Mr. Olympias over the last 43 years than the just the 11 that stand. Shawn Ray, Flex Wheeler, Kevin Laverone, Rich Gaspari, probably a couple of others, should also hold the title right now because the incumbent was over rated. I donít think thatís going to happen anymore.

                                This is going to be a very different era of bodybuilding.
                                I agree with everthing there except Gaspari. Talk about overrated...

                                I hope the era of zillion-time Olympia winners is over. I lost any real interest in the Olympia many years ago.

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