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View Poll Results: Who is the strongest?

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  • Paul Anderson

    19 15.83%
  • H. Razazadeh

    8 6.67%
  • Bill Kazmaier

    40 33.33%
  • Mariusz Pudzianowski

    53 44.17%
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Thread: Who is the Strongest man in history?

  1. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by BDEGRD View Post
    here is Ed Coen bench pressing "gym style" 555X2. Remember this guy only wears single ply, not those triple canvas deals.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkszyU1d03Y


    This is of Coen deadlifting 901 @ 220lbs. One of the greatest feats of strenth ever caught on video.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dpRC...eature=related

    Coen squating 950 x 2, straps down.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1Aiq...eature=related
    And Coan didnt even struggle with 901
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  2. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by m87r View Post
    Benedikt Magnusson probably don't do any olympic lifts regulary either but for some reason you claimed that he was pretty good at those lifts.
    Because he has some videos laying around doing some clean @ push-presses using around 400 lbs. Eddie Doesn't.


    Ed Coan has benched 545 raw at 220. That's a hell of a raw bench in my opinion and according to all time rankings also. Coan wouldn't win a comp like this but he wasn't a mediocre bencher(except with a shirt that is).
    He indeed "was" a mediocre bencher when comparing him against the "strongest" benchers of all time, which is exactly what I was doing and which I said I was doing. This isn't about who is the strongest per lb....it is about who would win in a 3-way contest....it's about who is the fuckin' strongest of all...period...and that isn't Eddie.

  3. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Katterle View Post
    1) Eddie Coan's mid-500s @ 220-242 raw make him one of the greatest raw benchers ever at 242 pounds or less.
    This is true, but like I said...I was "specifically" comparing his bench to the "best" benchers of all time and some others in the list (namely Kaz), not those in his weight class. I was ONLY referencing his ability to do well in this 3-way comp, not whether he did great in his weight class. Overall, a mid 500's bench is awesome for anyone anyone at his bodyweight, but it's not so great when comparing it against the 600-700 lbs benchers, which is what I was doing.

    And, because his benches were performed after max squatting, that makes it even more impressive. Look up how many 242 (or lighter) competitors have hit 545 raw in competition, then check how many of them were bench only and then look to see how many got that lift passed in a legit, strictly judged federation.
    Again, he was great in his weight class, but a LONG way off from the very best.


    2) We know that Bill Kazmaier could raw bench in the mid 600s but I'm not so sure about Savickas and Rezazadeh.
    Yep, I think 660 lbs.....and from what I understand, Kaz was focusing on beating the 660 lb bench he did the previous year, but tore his pec in the WSM, which ended his benching career. At any rate, he was a good deal stronger on the bench than Eddie. Kaz woulv'be stomped Coan in this type of 3-way comp. He would've easily dusted him in strongman, probably olympic lifting (I think that's safe bet)...and would've equalled him in powerlifting. Coan was possibly the best powerlifter of all time...probably is, but is he the strongest overall when using these 3 sports as the baromter? Nope.

    Many strong overhead lifters focus more on triceps, back and shoulder strength and their bench is in the 500s at SHW.
    True...strongmen have no need to bench press...so they usually don't...and they certainly dont specialize in it. Still, there are quite a few 600 lb benchers in strongman.

    3) Who specifically in your gym has raw benched 580+ ? I'm assuming you mean "with contest form"? Because a guy like Coan could hit a 600 if he was allowed to bench ugly.
    I knew Mike Lackner, who was an amatuer BB'r and a great bencher, but never competed as powerlifter. He trained briefly with a few powerlifters known as Angelo Berardinelli (165 lb world champ for a few years) and Mike Cartinian (198 lb world champ for a little while), both of whom traind at my gym, along with many other powerlifters. Angelo asked Mike to train with them, but it that didn't last long because he didn't like their methods.....not to mention he was stronger than all of them when it came to raw bench pressing and probably even raw squatting (Cartinian squatted 900 lbs at 198 with equipment, but Lackner was a stronger raw squatter, doing 700 lbs for a handful or reps to parallel.

    During this time, Lackner raw benched 580-585 lbs many times. He didn't officially pause, but he lowered the weight slow and just exploded back up when it touched him...he did NOT bouce at all. He laid completely FLAT on the bench...no arch at all...ass smashed into the bench. He was definitely not tryng to minimize his range of motion. Had he adjusted his form to maximize his poundages, he would've done even more...for sure. He was a lean 260-270 lbs at about 5'10...he was a very strong man and well known in the area. He has since movedout of state. This was probably around 8 years ago when he was doing this.

    4) Marc Henry, as much as I don't like his personality, would be very much in the running to win The Arnold Classic Pro Strongman if he was 100%. Henry's raw contest deadlifted 900+, he's raw contest squatted 900+, he was the first guy to one hand clean and press The Thomas Inch Dumbbell and he went to The Olympics for overhead pressing.
    Yeah, but I don't think he would win today. The Thomas inch dumbell isn't shit in strongman today. Guys lift much heavier bells for many reps today.

    Plus he won the 2002 Arnold Classic Pro Strongman, beating Svend Karlsen, Phil Pfister, Mark Philipi, Andy Bolton, Raimonds Burgmanis, Brad Gillingham and Brian Schoonveld (that's a crazee line-up right there!)
    Yep...but our guys are even better today at these strongman events. Strongman has progressed by leaps and bounds since 2002.


    5) And I didn't realise we were discussing who'd win in a three sport contest, sorry. I thought this thread was simply about who's the strongest overall, based on their performances in those sports. If a contest was held where each lifter had to perform the 3 powerlifts, the 2 Olympic lifts and 3 or 4 pro strongman events, then I'd say that Ken Patera and Serge Redding would be in the running too.
    I forgot about Patera...guys was crazy strong.


    These guys were true buffalos and, with them tipping the scales at the mid to high 300s, you aren't gonna find bigger backs, quads or shoulders.
    I agree....beasts...crazy....crazy! The good old days.
    ....

  4. #72
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  5. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by FUTURE View Post
    If you think Coan's bench is mediocre then you have no idea what you are talking about. Also Coan did with limited lifting equipment...a t shirt!
    If you think Coan's bench is anything but mediocre in comparison to the top benches of all time (which I made CLEAR I was referring to), despite weight class, then you have no idea what you're talking about. Somehow I figured a mid 500's bench would be considered "mediocre" in comparison to a 715 raw bnch, but I am not really sure how you compare numbers.

    Please enlighten us with the couple of 600 lb raw benchers in just your gym. You realize that your gym has a majority of the best raw benchers in the world?
    Rather, it must be that your gym just doesn't have any good lifters? First of all, LOL at your comment that my gym would have the "majority" of the best raw benchers simply because a coulple of guys could press between 580-600 lbs. Apparently, you do not know what you are talking about if you think that constitutes the "majority" of the world's best raw benchers.

    At it's peak, my gym housed a 165 lb world champion (Angerllo Berardinelli)....a 198 lb world champion (Mike Cartinian)....top 3 WSM finalist (Don Pope)....3-4 other pro strongmen....a powerlifter with one of the best co-fficients in the world at 165 lbs (forgot his name...he always came at weird hours)....several other elite level powerlifters (probably 8-10)....a powerlifter who could press 600 lbs raw with no pause, but other wise passing form (Big John at 308 lbs)....a "BB'r" (Mike Lackner...was in MuscleMag a few times) who could raw bench between 580-585 lbs with no pause, but no bounce and otherwise passing form (which he did many times at between 260-270 lean lbs). In fact, he never even tried to maximize his poundages by adjusting his form. He basically just laid down on the bench and started benching with zero regard for putting his body into position for maximum pressing strength. Very strong guy. Lastly, we would occasionally have some of the top lifters from Westside come up to train there (just a couple hours away),as guys like Angelo knew Louie Simmons and other guys from Westside, having trained there when he was younger.

    So, my gym was pretty well off. Sounds like your gym is lacking, no?

    .....

  6. #74

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    Thanks for explaining.

    As long as a gym has equipment I require it has little bearing on who attends for my training. Id love to train at a gym like that but I am not as fortunate.
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  7. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by FUTURE View Post
    Thanks for explaining.

    As long as a gym has equipment I require it has little bearing on who attends for my training. Id love to train at a gym like that but I am not as fortunate.
    I hear ya'.....and I agree.

  8. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Arnold View Post
    The Thomas inch dumbell isn't shit in strongman today. Guys lift much heavier bells for many reps today.
    No, Marc Henry picked the Thomas Inch Dumbbell off the floor with one hand (using the same grip style you'd use to pick up any other dumbbell) and then he cleaned and jerked it.

    The pro strongmen of today (Arnold Classic, World's Strongest Man, ect.) use two hands to pick up the dumbbell and to clean it.

    There's a huge difference between one feat of strength and the other. It's the one hand "picking up and cleaning" that makes that particular lift so impressive.



    "In Saddle Brook, New Jersey on Saturday night June 23, 2002, with a camera crew from the World Wrestling Entertainment company (formerly WWF) standing by, and with about 250 people watching, Mark Henry came out, and with one hand, power cleaned (dipped very little) the Inch 172 replica and push-pressed it overhead.

    He did keep the bell overhead for a couple of seconds, though it did not appear to be stabilized and still, before he threw it down from his right hand. He also deadlifted the bell with his left hand and carried it a few feet to a table.

    In my opinion, this is the very first time that an Inch 172 has ever been one handed all the way by anyone. If Mark weighed about 400 pounds, then the bell represented 43% of his bodyweight (for comparison, a 200 pound man would need to succeed with an 86 lb replica, to have proportionate strength). And lest anyone pooh-pooh this comparison, keep in mind that weight classes have been a part of weightlifting for more than a century." - Joe Roark, Iron History, http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/ironhistory8.htm
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  9. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Arnold View Post
    it's peak, my gym housed a 165 lb world champion (Angerllo Berardinelli)....a 198 lb world champion (Mike Cartinian)....top 3 WSM finalist (Don Pope)....3-4 other pro strongmen....a powerlifter with one of the best co-fficients in the world at 165 lbs (forgot his name...he always came at weird hours)....several other elite level powerlifters (probably 8-10)....a powerlifter who could press 600 lbs raw with no pause, but other wise passing form (Big John at 308 lbs)....a "BB'r" (Mike Lackner...was in MuscleMag a few times) who could raw bench between 580-585 lbs with no pause, but no bounce and otherwise passing form (which he did many times at between 260-270 lean lbs). In fact, he never even tried to maximize his poundages by adjusting his form. He basically just laid down on the bench and started benching with zero regard for putting his body into position for maximum pressing strength. Very strong guy. Lastly, we would occasionally have some of the top lifters from Westside come up to train there (just a couple hours away),as guys like Angelo knew Louie Simmons and other guys from Westside, having trained there when he was younger.
    Angelo Berardinelli won contests in the multi ply federations (WPO, APF, WPC, ect.) His numbers were impressive, but he took advantage of the 48 hour weigh-in (think about that, a TWO DAY weigh-in) and the loose judging (the federation that got dismissed by The Arnold Classic) to get his best official numbers on paper. Is he an impressive lifter? Yes. In fact, I did some work for a company that even made a poster of him deadlifting. But he wasn't anywhere near a 600 pound raw bench or even a 500 pound one for that matter.

    The same goes for Mike Cartinian. Compare Mike's deadlifts to his squats and you'll see how much the multi layer suit, monolift and judging is assisting him. Is Carinian strong? Heck yeah. Is he anywhere near raw benching 600 pounds? Nope.

    Don Pope is a huge guy and a great strongman but he never competed in the raw benchpress to my notion. And I've seen many pro strongmen get stuck in the low to mid 500s on the bench (at 300-400 pounds bodyweight) because it's not one of their standard competition lifts and form plays such a big role when you get over five hundred pounds.


    Westside Barbell has only produced one 600 pound raw contest bencher and that's the late, great Nick Winters.

    George Halbert was close as he was touch n' going with 600 @ 242.

    There's never been another full time (or close to full time) 600 pound contest raw bencher registered at that gym. Just like there's never been an IPF world champion, a USPF Senior National champion, a USAPL Open Division National Champion, a 100% RAW Open Division World Champion, ect. WSBB has a LOT of really strong lifters, but only one member of the 600 Pound Raw Bench Club.

    I just wanted to verify that. No panic, but your original post made it sound like there were multiple 600 pound raw benchers at your gym. It sounds like a couple of guys worked with 575 - 600 in the gym? That's not the same, but I'm sure you know that as I've read a lot of your posts and you come across as being knowledgable on the sport.
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  10. #78

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm7g5...eature=related

    Jón Páll was a legend, probably not the raw strongest man ever but the greatest.

    Also when Kaz, Jón Páll and Geoff Capes competed in a special competition to see who was the strongest ever Jón Páll won 8 out of 10 events.

  11. #79

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    NEW QUESTION who would win in the same 3 day meet. Magnus Ver Magnusson or Benidikt Magnusson, which sibling is the strongest overall.

  12. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heidar View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm7g5...eature=related

    Jón Páll was a legend, probably not the raw strongest man ever but the greatest.

    Also when Kaz, Jón Páll and Geoff Capes competed in a special competition to see who was the strongest ever Jón Páll won 8 out of 10 events.
    Here's all the videos from that promotion's four year span.

    http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/blogs...lifting/?p=333
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  13. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by BDEGRD View Post
    NEW QUESTION who would win in the same 3 day meet. Magnus Ver Magnusson or Benidikt Magnusson, which sibling is the strongest overall.
    Benni is considerably stronger at 1RM lifting.

    Magnus would excel at medley or "power endurance" drills that involve running/fast walking or carrying objects for distance.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Katterle View Post
    No, Marc Henry picked the Thomas Inch Dumbbell off the floor with one hand (using the same grip style you'd use to pick up any other dumbbell) and then he cleaned and jerked it.

    The pro strongmen of today (Arnold Classic, World's Strongest Man, ect.) use two hands to pick up the dumbbell and to clean it.

    There's a huge difference between one feat of strength and the other. It's the one hand "picking up and cleaning" that makes that particular lift so impressive.


    Yes, it is incredibly hard to lift with one hand, but they don't do that anymore in the ASC strongman because it severely limits the amount of weight which can be lifted overhead. In this sense, the Thomas Inch dummbell is disproportionate. Today, we have guys using 2 hands to clean the bell, but it can weigh up to 225 lbs....and some guys are pressing it for many reps. I severely doubt mark would've defeated someone like Derek Poundstone in this current version of the lift.

  15. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Katterle View Post
    Angelo Berardinelli won contests in the multi ply federations (WPO, APF, WPC, ect.) His numbers were impressive, but he took advantage of the 48 hour weigh-in (think about that, a TWO DAY weigh-in) and the loose judging (the federation that got dismissed by The Arnold Classic) to get his best official numbers on paper.
    Of course he did...he dropped almost 20 lbs and gained it all back in a matter of 5-6 hours. One time he was so swollen from the methods used to put the weight back on after making weight, that he couldn't fit into his equipment.

    Is he an impressive lifter? Yes. In fact, I did some work for a company that even made a poster of him deadlifting. But he wasn't anywhere near a 600 pound raw bench or even a 500 pound one for that matter.
    Nope...he never did bench that much and I never said, nor did I imply that he did.....I was simply making mntion of the fact he trained at my gym. I never once said how much he benched or compared him to any of the guys we were speaking about in this thread. I was just letting you know they trained there. Angelo benched 435 lbs raw in contest form at the gtym. He wasn't a raw lifter, so he nver did it at a meet, but many of us saw him do between 425-435 with perfect form, as the guy was a form fanatic.

    The same goes for Mike Cartinian. Compare Mike's deadlifts to his squats and you'll see how much the multi layer suit, monolift and judging is assisting him.
    Yep...he could only squat in the mid 600's raw, 3 months before setting his then record 900 lb geared squat. I have no doubt he recieved at least 200 lbs of help froim his gear, but then again....you know how much I hate gear. In fact, this was the primary reason I only trained with them for about 3 months....I hated the gear and the fake numbers. I was a stronger raw bencher and raw deadlifter than both Angelo and Cartinian. Of course, I weighed more (about 250 lbs at the time), but just knowing these guys were "world" champions, yet I was stronger than 2 out of 3 lifts than they were (I never squated...fuckin' hate it...and I don't give a SHIT!)....it made me hate gear.

    But again...I never stated anything contray to what your stating here. I agree and already know EXACTLY what they did and could do, as well as what they weighed, how much weight they dropped, what gear they used, even their cycles, etc. As a side point, Angelo used a VERY small amount of gear and NEVER went high in his dosages. I am telling you the truth when I say Angelo could've bean a good deal stronger than he was, but refused to compriomise his health. He built most of his strength through bust-ass and dedicated training. I will not diclose what he used, but let's just say he used a certain oral that starts with a "D" at only 5-10 mg/day and old-school injectables at beginner dosages. Only around contest would he add a couple other things and veen then, it was very low dosages.

    Is Carinian strong? Heck yeah. Is he anywhere near raw benching 600 pounds? Nope.
    I doubt he could even do 500 lbs. In fact, I bet he was no stronger than about 475-490 lbs raw. He NEVER benched 500 lbs raw even one time.

    Don Pope is a huge guy and a great strongman but he never competed in the raw benchpress to my notion.
    Correct, but I never said he did. Again...i was only making mention of the facvt he trained at my gym...NOT that he was agreat bencher. Honestly, I don't know what he benched, but I doubt it was anymore than lower 500's.

    And I've seen many pro strongmen get stuck in the low to mid 500s on the bench (at 300-400 pounds bodyweight) because it's not one of their standard competition lifts and form plays such a big role when you get over five hundred pounds.
    True, although we do have a few very strong benchers in strongman.

    Westside Barbell has only produced one 600 pound raw contest bencher and that's the late, great Nick Winters.
    Yep...they are all using gear.

    George Halbert was close as he was touch n' going with 600 @ 242.

    There's never been another full time (or close to full time) 600 pound contest raw bencher registered at that gym. Just like there's never been an IPF world champion, a USPF Senior National champion, a USAPL Open Division National Champion, a 100% RAW Open Division World Champion, ect. WSBB has a LOT of really strong lifters, but only one member of the 600 Pound Raw Bench Club.

    I just wanted to verify that. No panic, but your original post made it sound like there were multiple 600 pound raw benchers at your gym. It sounds like a couple of guys worked with 575 - 600 in the gym?
    That's exactly what I said...an I even explained ina couple previous posts that they did not pause with the weight. We had one guy who benched between 580-585 lbs MANY times over a several year period (mike lackner)....he was NOT a powerlifter...he was a BB'r and was stronger than EVERY powerlifter in the gym when averaging all 3 raw lifts...and he was wayyyy stronger on asisstance work. He benched 500 X 6...all solid reps with no bounce, no arch. The truth is he could DEFINITELY have done 585 lbs in "competition" had he adjusted his form to maximize his strength. He wasn't doing ANY of the things we are taught to do in order to lift more weight. The guy just laid flat on the bench, grabbed the bar, lifted it off....and would slwoly control the weight until it touched hus chest, then explode back up. Both of us know how much of a difference proper technique can make in big bench numbrs....he was far from applying those techniques.

    We also had another guy (Bog John is what everyone called him). He was a powerlifter. He raw deadlifted about 750 lbs in the gym with no gear, and raw benched 600 lbs one time. I never saw him do it again after that. He could close grip raw bench mid 500's for a single. He did this more than once. He did NOT bouce and he did not arch (I often wondered why none of the top powerlifters arched in my gym...NONE of them). Personally, I wouldn't be one but suprised if he could do 600 lbs in competition, as I saw how it looked at the gym. Not every strong guy competes...or does a meet when at his strongest. John competed many times in meets, but stopped competing towards the end, but continued to get stronger. He is now nowhere even close to what he was. He has no cartilage in his knees and joint problems everywhere.

    That's not the same, but I'm sure you know that as I've read a lot of your posts and you come across as being knowledgable on the sport.
    I very much do understand it, but I am telling you....I wish you could've seen this Lackner guy. Angelo tried to get him to lift with him because he saw how strong he really was as a BB'r, but after a very short while, Lackner went back to his old ways. You know when a guy hits 500 x 6 and 405 X 16-17, that he is strong.
    .....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heidar View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm7g5...eature=related

    Jón Páll was a legend, probably not the raw strongest man ever but the greatest.

    Also when Kaz, Jón Páll and Geoff Capes competed in a special competition to see who was the strongest ever Jón Páll won 8 out of 10 events.

    Yes, but Kaz was no longer at his peak, so that does not count. Kaz competed against him after he had had torn a pec, after his powerlifting days were over...and he just wanted to make a comeback. He was no longer at his best.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Arnold View Post
    .....
    Mike....the gym you are talking about in Mentor? I remember seeing Mike Lackner when he was getting ready for the Collegiate Nationals! He was big as shit!
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