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Thread: Diet: Warrior's 14-Day CKD for Pre-Cycle Priming :.

  1. #69

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    Well i have re-read this article quite a few times so i hope this question is not repetitive.

    My question is plain and simple: Given the structure of your training / diet protocol - what type of intensity should we use with cardio.? I understand the fact that during the week we are trying to strip away glycogen which can be done with moderate to high intensity cardio however there's a chance that muscle can be burned if proper nutrition is not consumed(IE: BCAA/Glutamine before/after sessions)

    On the other hand: By keeping our heart rate udner 130bpm we can focus on fat oxidation with minimal muscle loss which of course is our optimal goal.

    I will be starting a log a week from today and i'm just finishing up all my meal plans for you warrior so you can hopefully glance at it and see if everything looks good as far as starting points. Can't finish the meal plan b/c not sure if how much caloric expenditure i will have from cardio. thanks for the help again.

  2. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by Epifiny View Post
    Well i have re-read this article quite a few times so i hope this question is not repetitive.

    My question is plain and simple: Given the structure of your training / diet protocol - what type of intensity should we use with cardio.? I understand the fact that during the week we are trying to strip away glycogen which can be done with moderate to high intensity cardio however there's a chance that muscle can be burned if proper nutrition is not consumed(IE: BCAA/Glutamine before/after sessions)

    On the other hand: By keeping our heart rate udner 130bpm we can focus on fat oxidation with minimal muscle loss which of course is our optimal goal.

    I will be starting a log a week from today and i'm just finishing up all my meal plans for you warrior so you can hopefully glance at it and see if everything looks good as far as starting points. Can't finish the meal plan b/c not sure if how much caloric expenditure i will have from cardio. thanks for the help again.
    Call me crazy, but I can't stand that low-heart rate advocacy for endurance training during fat-loss programs. If you want to make a change in your body, you must introduce a requirement for that change to occur. You have to hit your system with a need to adapt. You must exceed your current fitness level - you must demand your body drops excess fat and become more athletic. When you do cardio, people should slip on the sweat trail coming from your area. Furthermore, you should be watching how many calories you expend in a given time... and then try and meet or exceed it next time (given the same day, same conditions). For instance, when I start these rotations, I might cycle for 60 minutes and burn 1000 calories. After 10-12 weeks, I might have built my endurance up to 1200-1300 calories per 60 minutes - and my limit strength does not drop, due to well-timed carb loads and power workouts.

    The goal here is to streamline your body, while retaining muscle. Muscle retention is primarily promoted through diet. By entering ketosis, your body learns to prefer fats for fuel - and when you make that switch, it's a powerful fuel source at nine kilocalories per gram! Fats are very energy dense... this is why you tend to feel rejuvenated after you have been in ketosis for a few days. With this 14-day CKD, you actually feel better the second week, not the first. Get the body pumping fats into the blood stream, then draw on that liberated energy as fuel for the aerobic energy systems - by really turning up the heat in your internal furnace.

    With the scheduled carb ups, after becoming totally depleted, you promote anabolism with a tremendous capacity to store incoming glycogen... and the power workout immediately after a carb up is your make or break point for strength - you must push and pull loads that meet or exceed the last power workout. If you find you're getting weaker during the power workouts, as well as a marked difference during the first weeks giant sets, then first look at the integrity of your carb loads. It's my recommendation that you try adding more calories to your carb loads before cutting back on your endurance training. It's not unreasonable to become stronger with each rotation...

    You got two major manipulators for muscle retention here - the amount of calories (carbs) you can pack in during the 36-hour load... and the amount of energy you expend during the weekly endurance training. If you are losing strength, don't cut back on hard and long cardio sessions until you try to increase how much you pack in during a carb load... which can become real uncomfortable for those holding a decent amount of lean body mass - your eating all damn day long - shoveling in oats, rice, breads, cereals, - whatever you carb up with best.

    To spare muscle nutritionally, take in 10 grams of BCAA preworkout – and 30-40 grams of glutamine post workout. If the glutamine is simply too expensive, than you can cut it with some whey, but try and keep it at least half-and-half…

    Trust me. Your heart rate must exceed 130 beats per minute; otherwise you would hardly break a sweat, let alone create a fitness stimulus for your body to react on.

  3. #71

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    sounds good - my gym has the HIIT cycling(spinning) classes that i always enjoyed back in the day - i will probably work those in when i can. On other days just use stepmill / eliptical.

  4. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by Epifiny View Post
    sounds good - my gym has the HIIT cycling(spinning) classes that i always enjoyed back in the day - i will probably work those in when i can. On other days just use stepmill / eliptical.
    The spinning would be best at the beginning... as you start to deplete you need something with a variable resistance - such as cycling or a stepmill.

    BTW - a workout journal is mandatory for this - you must track your loads, reps, sets and possibly even total workout duration. For example, if you are performing the same power workout but it's taking 15 minutes longer, that is not a good sign. On the other side, if your chest giant sets take you nine minutes to complete one week - then eight minutes the next, using the same loads and rep, that's a good thing - a sign you are gaining. You must track everything in workout journal - that is, how well you perform in both endurance and weight-training sessions.

  5. #73

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    i understand completely - ill be documenting everything and updating the thread every week or so with logs and stats as well as every 4 week get BF measurements,etc.

  6. #74
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    Warrior, as far as cardio, do you think that it is necessery to go higher than 120 bpm if your goal is to get to a lean 8 % bf? I know diet is key here. But with a low caloric, low carb, wouldn't just walking be enough to get as lean as possible?

  7. #75

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    jac -might wanna scroll up and read the complete thread - he just answered this question a day or 2 ago.

  8. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by jacenty View Post
    Warrior, as far as cardio, do you think that it is necessery to go higher than 120 bpm if your goal is to get to a lean 8 % bf? I know diet is key here. But with a low caloric, low carb, wouldn't just walking be enough to get as lean as possible?
    That's into the realm of extreme fat loss for already athletic body types. What I was mostly concerned about in my last post was getting people down to sub 10 percent levels. Sad but true, a lot of bodybuilders begin AAS cycles at well over 18 percent - which is incredibly too high. In an otherwise well-intentioned effort to cut fat, many people get caught up in real low intensity cardio and gain nothing from it - or worse, their body adapts in a way that it becomes more efficient in hording fat... ever heard of Poliquin's Chunky Aerobic Instructor Syndrome? Basically, it's a metabolic explanation on why aerobic instructors can do repetitive cardio sessions throughout the day, but still look flabby. Resistance training helps, but there also needs to be more of a push for a performance inroad that stimulates an adaptive response from the training. Otherwise, the body is doing what it’s already capable of doing… so all it needs to do is slow down metabolism to fuel the low-intensity exercise.

    On the flip side…

    If your holding a lot of muscle and dropping below 8-10 percent, then I would suggest being very methodical about maintaining strength levels while balancing the energy in versus energy out equation. Endurance intensities experienced at over 15 percent body fat is going to pale in comparison when you are 8 percent. This is because you are streamlined for performance – any excess baggage is gone and your aerobic energy systems are much more efficient. At this point, it’s highly likely you don’t need to endure very exhausting cardio sessions anymore - since your fitness level is higher. Furthermore, it could easily become detrimental to maintaining muscle at low body fats - depending on other training and diet variables. By and large, for the under 8 percent crew, really pushing hard at long cardio sessions becomes far less recommended. Sprinters are muscular - fast long distance runners are not.

    Kinda get what I am suggesting?

  9. #77

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    Great to have you back. I am currently holding 210 @ 9%BF doing 2-3 full body HIT workouts weekly. In two weeks I will do 2 cycles of 14CKD preparing for a 4 week bulk cycle. I am going to try RR's 4 week burst cycles, then back on HRT for weeks, repeat. During the 4 week HRT, I will do the CKD workouts to prepare for the next burst. I will keep you posted on how it goes.

  10. #78
    Spotter jacenty's Avatar
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    thanks warrior for the explanation. I hear you on fat chubby areobic instructors. I ve always wondered why they look so bad when they do hours of cardio a day.

    Anyway I wish it wasn't so complicated.

    I have one more question tho. Is there some formula on how to calculate how many calories you burn if you know you bpm, weight, duration and all that? Becasue I have always wondered whether you burn more calories lets say cycling for 40 min at 120 bm or 20 min at 140 bpm.

  11. #79
    Spotter jacenty's Avatar
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    forgot to ask on more thing. So your are saying that in order to maintain my curent conditioning, I am at around 9% bf, I d be better off doing 15- 20 minutes of high intensity cardio a couplke of times a week , rather than gruelling 60 min of low intensity sessions? My goal is to maintain my current conditioning, as far as fat pecentage. I just want to intoduce more carbs into my diet but I don;t want to get that bloated look I get when I don't do any cardio.

  12. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by axioma View Post
    Great to have you back. I am currently holding 210 @ 9%BF doing 2-3 full body HIT workouts weekly. In two weeks I will do 2 cycles of 14CKD preparing for a 4 week bulk cycle. I am going to try RR's 4 week burst cycles, then back on HRT for weeks, repeat. During the 4 week HRT, I will do the CKD workouts to prepare for the next burst. I will keep you posted on how it goes.
    Excellent!

  13. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by jacenty View Post
    thanks warrior for the explanation. I hear you on fat chubby areobic instructors. I ve always wondered why they look so bad when they do hours of cardio a day.

    Anyway I wish it wasn't so complicated.

    I have one more question tho. Is there some formula on how to calculate how many calories you burn if you know you bpm, weight, duration and all that? Becasue I have always wondered whether you burn more calories lets say cycling for 40 min at 120 bm or 20 min at 140 bpm.
    Not really... this kinda goes inline with people complaining about a scale being off a couple pounds... or a body fat measurement being inaccurate by a couple percent. Find a trustworthy and consistent method of measurement and go with that... if a scale is off by five pounds, it should always be off by five. If someone uses body fat calipers with a 3 percent margin for error - they should always be pinching the same way...

    Many cardio machines have ways to measure your body fat, heart rate, intensity and duration to come up with a round-about answer... some even ask for age - the more information you plug in the better. You can find these counters on Life cycles, Stair masters and Elliptical machines. They will tell you how much calories you expend per workout - but when trying to compare results, do so using the same apparatus - with the same internal mechanism for generating the guess (what it basically is).

    It's really hard to base it on one simple equation though.... there can be a lot of variation found in the substrates used to fuel the specific training session (lipids, glycogen, proteins), environmental temperatures at the time... your last meal... your fitness level at that moment - even how stressed you are and your hormonal balance...

    I could give you an equation to find out this mystical number, but I'd be full of shit... the body's energy systems are too complicated for that. Just use a method that takes into account as many variables as possible - and stick to it as a reporting method... such as the plug-and-play displays on today's cardio equipment...

  14. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by jacenty View Post
    forgot to ask on more thing. So your are saying that in order to maintain my curent conditioning, I am at around 9% bf, I d be better off doing 15- 20 minutes of high intensity cardio a couplke of times a week , rather than gruelling 60 min of low intensity sessions? My goal is to maintain my current conditioning, as far as fat pecentage. I just want to intoduce more carbs into my diet but I don;t want to get that bloated look I get when I don't do any cardio.
    Some occasional long-distance endurance training can help keep pushing fats into the blood and burned up, but keep your heart rate reasonable since you are no longer trying to improve your cardio respiratory fitness - your simply trying to keep your activity levels elevated in an effort to reach very low body fat levels.

    Other than that, some low volume, high-intensity, cardio can be a good way to inject some variety in your training... just keep it brief and intense.

  15. #83
    Spotter jacenty's Avatar
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    thanks for the previous responses....

    Warrior since your a strong believer in short cycles I was thinking you could help me out with this.

    I was planning on doing a 6-7 weeker (test only). I d like to go first 4-5 weeks with omnadren and finish off with prop.

    Since omnadren is a mix I am having hard time trying to figure out how to frontload it since it has prop in it.. I'd like to run it around 500mg/week so I was thinking I could go 750mg the first week and then go 500mg for the remaining weeks and switch over to prop for the last 3 weeks ang go into pct.
    I hear opinions that omnadren is not the best way to go, as far as short cycles. what do you think? I still have a lot of omnas laying around so I figured I could give them a shot. I'd appreciate you opinion on this.

  16. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by jacenty View Post
    thanks for the previous responses....

    Warrior since your a strong believer in short cycles I was thinking you could help me out with this.

    I was planning on doing a 6-7 weeker (test only). I d like to go first 4-5 weeks with omnadren and finish off with prop.

    Since omnadren is a mix I am having hard time trying to figure out how to frontload it since it has prop in it.. I'd like to run it around 500mg/week so I was thinking I could go 750mg the first week and then go 500mg for the remaining weeks and switch over to prop for the last 3 weeks ang go into pct.
    I hear opinions that omnadren is not the best way to go, as far as short cycles. what do you think? I still have a lot of omnas laying around so I figured I could give them a shot. I'd appreciate you opinion on this.
    Yeah, that's fine... the front load just isn't as much since there is propionate and phenylpropinate in the oil... but most importantly, Sustanon and Omnadren should be taken every other day during a cycle because of these short esters - to maintain even blood levels. Taking it twice a week would cause a lot of ups and downs. I don't know your stats but if you are going for a short cycle, would 250mg EOD be unreasonable? That works out to ~875mg/wk. If that's too much, consider enanthate or cypionate for your cycle.

    Remember, if you cut back your usual duration, dose can be increased... most unwanted side effects come at the tail end of a cycle. Short blast cycle theories often preach twice the normal weekly intake for 4-5 weeks. If you usually do ~500mg per week for 8-10 weeks... then 875mg for 6-7 weeks is not totally out of the realm of possibility.

    What's will your starting height, weight and body fat be... and how long have you been training?

  17. #85
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    I am 5'8, 175 lbs at around 9-10 %. I am planning to stay there for the next 3 months and start the short cycle. I have been training for 6 years. I have run 4 mild-doses cycles so far (250-600mg of oil per week) 12-14 th weekers. So those were pretty long cycles.

    Just finished a 12 week cycle of 250mg omnandren + 300mg EQ. It was a lean bulker then cutter and I sort of all messed it up, but managed to got down from 12%bf to about 8% though. Even tho I injhected omnas once a week I did not really experience any side effects.

    There is laso one more thing that concerns me, since it takes about 3-4 weeks for omnadren to clear the system, is it possible to run a short cycle using omnadren?

    After reading your response I think I could run it 750mg for the first 4 weeks, then swith to prop and run it say 100mg eod for the remaining 3 weeks, which would give me solid 7 weeks on a cycle. What do you think?

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