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Thread: FIBER TYPE TRAINING EXPLAINED

  1. #35
    Iron Addict chasebny's Avatar
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    Im a little confgused by ur suggestion of not letting amuscle become un-contracted once it becomes contracted in the set. R u saying there should be no intense stretch for say wide grip chins.

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    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasebny View Post
    Im a little confgused by ur suggestion of not letting amuscle become un-contracted once it becomes contracted in the set. R u saying there should be no intense stretch for say wide grip chins.

    Explain the stretch. In between reps at the top? I think most will agree very few of us are truly strong enough to be able to execute a full proper explosive rep doing wide grip chins let alone reps up to 15, due to our bodyweight. I suggest doing wide grip pulldowns to the clavicle executing them in the same explosive continuous rep style as you would see as you watched an olympic rowing team.

    The stretch should be done afterwards. As I've stated earlier, each set which potentialy SHORTENS the muscle must be followed up with an elongation protocol of your choice. You should be stretching from your insertion at the bottom near your waist to the top near your armpit and concentrate on holding it to cause elongation over a period of time.
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  3. #37
    Iron Addict chasebny's Avatar
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    ur saying that a muscle most be contracted through out a set correct? Well on any exercise asre u saying no to get a deep stretch and contraction on each rep?

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    Iron Addict bhman6's Avatar
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    while I don't think peak contraction DURING an exercise is very beneficial, I do think that after emphasis the stretch on a given exercise that ending with a peak contraction/stretching protocol like Tipsta recommended above is a good idea

    I personally end my bodyparts with a flushing set with stretch emphasis and then I do a PNF stretching cycle which alternates periods of extreme facilitated stretching with extreme muscular contraction

    a 2 min. PNF cycle is more painful than most sets you could do (aside from maybe high rep squats)

  5. #39
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasebny View Post
    ur saying that a muscle most be contracted through out a set correct? Well on any exercise asre u saying no to get a deep stretch and contraction on each rep?
    Thats what I'm saying. Where is the benefit to the fast twitch fiber your way?
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  6. #40
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhman6 View Post
    while I don't think peak contraction DURING an exercise is very beneficial, I do think that after emphasis the stretch on a given exercise that ending with a peak contraction/stretching protocol like Tipsta recommended above is a good idea

    I personally end my bodyparts with a flushing set with stretch emphasis and then I do a PNF stretching cycle which alternates periods of extreme facilitated stretching with extreme muscular contraction

    a 2 min. PNF cycle is more painful than most sets you could do (aside from maybe high rep squats)

    I couldnt agree more except for the calves. Because of the fiber makeup they respond to peak contactive work where NO other muscle will, as its the ONLY muscle designated to hold a peak contracted state for very long periods of time.

    Ask any competitor how sore their calves are after a show. I bet more sore than any workout they endured through their contest prep. Thats because for the first time they just held that contracted state for periods of time during the posing rounds. Think about a charlie horse you get in the middle of the night. Because of the intense contraction that your body caused in your calf you were probably sore for days. More sore than any rep type workout I bet.
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  7. #41
    Beach Body Deerod021's Avatar
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    Great thread! TIPSTA you have PM.
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  8. #42
    Iron Addict bhman6's Avatar
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    thats an interesting point regarding the calves

    I still think the stretch position is more important but now that I think about it I do tend to hold the contraction a little more than with most other bodyparts

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    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhman6 View Post
    thats an interesting point regarding the calves

    I still think the stretch position is more important but now that I think about it I do tend to hold the contraction a little more than with most other bodyparts

    I've been hearing from this kid at the gym that I'm genetically gifted in the calves since his look like a flamingos. He claims he does everything possible. After the first 2 sets I took him through he had to stop and couldnt train because his calves kept cramping up like a competitor at a show. He no longer questions my calf advice after crying like a girl. His response to be exact was "Dude, thats insane"
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  10. #44
    Beach Body Deerod021's Avatar
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    How many times per week do you work calves?
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  11. #45
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deerod021 View Post
    How many times per week do you work calves?

    Once
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  12. #46
    Iron Addict chasebny's Avatar
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    Tipsta can u list rep ranges and speeds for bodyparts?

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    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasebny View Post
    Tipsta can u list rep ranges and speeds for bodyparts?
    I suggest rep ranges of 12 to 15 depending on the bodypart but I also suggest TRULY failing 3 or so prior then rest pausing to the final number.

    Speeds? Every rep should be done with the most positive speed possible. the faster you try to move the weight the more intense the fast twitch fiber fires initially. Thats most important with the fast twitch fiber. However some will go longer in duration than others as in biceps but each rep I pull up is balls to the walls explosive.

    Maybe this will demonstrate better. Notice ALL the reps are explosive and consistant with never allowing the muscle to become uncontracted at any point of the sets.

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=UYov15S3RFU
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    Super Moderator Daibhí O'Buadain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tipsta View Post
    Each of us human beings are exactly the same in genetic makeup. We all have the exact same muscle groups designed to do the exact same job whether you believe in GOD or aliens or evolution, the human body is an incredible machine and has been designed to aid us in our everyday responsibilities.
    Lets look at each muscle and what they do for us. Lets say somebody threw something at your face, your response would be to throw your hands up VERY quickly in an explosive movement to protect yourself. Very similar to what a fighter does to throw a punch. The chest shoulders and triceps work in a similar manor as they are made up of fibers that have an amazing ability to explode very quickly with great force. However these muscles can only produce that force for a very short time. For those old enough to remember, Muhamad Ali used a method he called the rope a dope. He didnt know the science of the fast twitch fibers that exist within the chest shoulders or triceps. What he did know is that these muscles could NOT fire at peak for very long periods so he would cover up and let his opponent unload on him until he quickly tired out then he dominated because of the lost power his opponent endured. That being understood the chest shoulders and triceps are made up MAINLY of fibers that are designated to have great explosive strength for limited amounts of time.

    Lets take a look at a muscle that is the complete OPPOSITE. The bicep. Think about carrying a bag home from the store. You can go for miles and your arms will hold the bag in an L shape position without ANY contractile movement of the bicep. The bicep has fibers that are designated to be able to stay contracted and resist weight with NO movement for very long periods of time. It has no true explosive positive power since there is no need for a human to have that ability in that muscle. It is MAINLY a slow twitch fibered muscle.

    Lets take a look at the Legs as well as the back. These fibers are similar to the chest shoulders and triceps but differ as they have an ability to perform for a much longer period. Take a look at olympic rowers. They row explosively all while keeping a consistant level of explosive energy. They will row for 3 plus minutes and lose VERY little power. Think about a football player who catches the ball in the endzone. He will explode with great force and run the entire field with explosive contractions from his quads and will be able to go for distance. Legs are most obvious designed for LONG term use as we cant run or walk a marathon on our hands.

    Now lets look at the calves. They have a fiber that is designed like no other. When we need to reach for something very high we explode on our toes and reach for the item all while increasing the PEAK CONTRACTION to reach even higher. The calves are made up of fibers that contract extremely fast to a peak contracted state and can hold that INTENSE contraction for a long period of time.

    In order to ACTIVATE the majority of fibers that exist within a muscle we must be able to duplicate its action. This is the most important thing, yet it has never been addressed properly.
    A truly excellent post.
    IMO, every single person that is serious about weight training, should take at least, a entry level course in anatomy/physiology, at a local community college.

    Muscles should be trained, by function/action type.

    IMO, when designing a training plan, the body should be thought of as a functional total integrated neural entity, not thought of as individual detached muscles.

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    Super Moderator Daibhí O'Buadain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tipsta View Post
    I suggest rep ranges of 12 to 15 depending on the bodypart but I also suggest TRULY failing 3 or so prior then rest pausing to the final number.

    Speeds? Every rep should be done with the most positive speed possible. the faster you try to move the weight the more intense the fast twitch fiber fires initially. Thats most important with the fast twitch fiber. However some will go longer in duration than others as in biceps but each rep I pull up is balls to the walls explosive.

    Maybe this will demonstrate better. Notice ALL the reps are explosive and consistant with never allowing the muscle to become uncontracted at any point of the sets.

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=UYov15S3RFU
    Another fine post Tipsta.

    Load / tension/ time, is the key to hypertrophy and God only knows how many people I have observed over the years in a gym, that don't understand that fundamental principle.

  16. #50
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DBowden View Post
    A truly excellent post.
    IMO, every single person that is serious about weight training, should take at least, a entry level course in anatomy/physiology, at a local community college.

    Muscles should be trained, by function/action type.

    IMO, when designing a training plan, the body should be thought of as a functional total integrated neural entity, not thought of as individual detached muscles.

    What blows my mind is this seems like a no brainer to me and most people I speak to say......I never ever heard of this. Am I really that far ahead of the curve? I dont think so. I just think that as sad as it is, this sport is NOT filled with people who truly understand the functions of each muscle as it pertains to the human body. Basically they are gym science educated and not very medically science educated.
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  17. #51
    Iron Addict chasebny's Avatar
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    im a little confused. ur saying that you do12-15 reps including rest pauses on all ur sets with continous contractions and explosive concentric movement correct? Then how is this training to the funcitionality of each body type, if as u say it u can hold a bag of groceries with your bicep for an extended period of time but can only throw punches (tris and shoulders) for a short amount of time? Im a little confused, r u saying that all bodyparts have the same slow and fast twitch ratio? I think u need to clear up your analogy slightly if its no trouble. Ur analogy makes it sound as if u want to train biceps longer, and keep shoulder tri workouts short and explosive.

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