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Thread: GDA's

  1. #69
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    I gotta tell ya this is exausting!!!! They aid insulin! Period!!! Thats it!!!

    Why is this so confusing. I got a 20 second explanation when I was introduced to them.


    Arent these the same qustions you asked before? You laughed because you know its true.

    Treat them like creatine. Take them and forget about them.
    TRAIN HARD AND WIN EASY!!!
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  2. #70
    Behemoth johngorman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tipsta View Post
    I gotta tell ya this is exausting!!!! They aid insulin! Period!!! Thats it!!!

    Why is this so confusing. I got a 20 second explanation when I was introduced to them.


    Arent these the same qustions you asked before? You laughed because you know its true.

    Treat them like creatine. Take them and forget about them.
    Good enough then.

  3. #71
    Behemoth johngorman's Avatar
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    Fine, I will do the footwork here on supersaturation and keto diets. I have Duchaine's book here in front of me, so I'll just type and transfer the info here. This shit fascinates me................it's Duchaines 7 day BodyOpus ketogenic diet with supercompensation on the weekend.

    Monday:

    Calories- 10% below maintenance levels.
    Food- all fat and protein sources. NO CARBS!!!
    Activity- muscles will be full today from the carb load over the weekend, so workouts will be best on today. train half your body today (upper body).
    Tricks- Glucose Disposal Agents will speed you ascent into ketosis.
    Aerobics- not recommended because they will effect tuesdays workout negatively. however, aerobics will speed your descent into ketosis if done at 70% or higher max heart rate.
    Mood- you wont be hurting on monday because you will be full of glycogen.

    Tuesday: most uncomfortable day because blood glucose will be around 50 mg/dl.

    Calories- 10% less than maintenance, NO CARBS

    Food types- same as monday

    Activity- train the other half of the body. aerobics afterwards are fine. by mid evening you should be in ketosis.

    Tricks- if your blood glucose reading isnt 60 mg/dl, you can use chromium and vanadyl sulfate with a soluble protein drink to lower levels.

    Wednesday and Thursday: Cruise days of just aerobics.

    Friday: will go through ketosis, post ketosis, and recomposition all in one day.

    Food- 1 -2 hours before your workout (which will be a full body workout to deplete glycogen to very low levels) eat some carbs 100-200 calories, bananas or apples are ideal here. sucrose, fructose and glucose will work together to suit the purpose here.

    Activity- do aerobics in the AM when in ketosis. do a complete body workout (lasts about two hours). i am not going to list the complete workout, it's in the book. it is one monster workout where you deplete every muscle group. you can use your imagination here. i am picturing a ralphing pail myself!

    So basically you train upperbody on monday, lower body tuesday, aerobics the rest of the week, and then friday evening one giant monster workout to train the whole body and deplete glycogen. During the week Mon-Friday you are in ketosis and eating no carbs until right after the giant workout friday evening.

    Friday's Post Workout Eating and into the weekend;

    Stage 1; initial 24 hours of feeding, 12 feedings (one every 2 hours, even while sleeping)
    type foods- glucose, glucose polymers and starches (the real sugary stuff)
    Meals 1-4; drink 2 grams carbs to Lean body mass in kg. drink carb drinks with simple sugars, you can add protein to these.

    Meals 5-8; these should be liquid carbs and solid high glycemic carbs (corn flakes), 1.5 carbs per kg LBMass.

    Meals 9-12; finally some real food! eat .5 grams per lean mass from solid starches and liquid carbs. as usual, add protein to each meal.

    Stage 2; 25-48 hours of feeding, 12 feedings

    type foods- mixed, primarily starches
    Meals 1-4; 1 gram per pound solid carbs

    Meals 5-8; .75 gram per pound of complex carbs, rice, potatoes, pasta, etc. insulin sensitivity is declining in this stage.

    Meals 9-12; .5 gram per pound of liquid sugar carbs to give you a sugar crash and get you ready for your descent into ketosis.

    this should last until sunday evening. start the cycle over on monday.

    from what i gather here is that you can burn a decent amount of fat while in ketosis, and then super saturate your muscles over the weekend. he doesnt go into specifics on how much of the GDA's to use, so that's something that experimenting with a glucometer would tell us. basically the GDA's would shuttle all the nutrients into the muscle without having much if any stored in the fat cell. they would also aid by getting you into ketosis faster (36 hours) instead of the traditional 72 hours.

    personally, if i could just eat shit all weekend (pizza, cake, ice cream) and then be on a ketogenic diet all week i would be in heaven. unfortunately that wont work.

    Duchaine was way ahead of his time. i recommend this book, but be warned- he is one of those guys who is genius but also a quack at the same time. i love it.

    this is it in a small nutshell, and i am too lazy to type up all the small details. if you want those, buy his BodyOpus book.

  4. #72
    Beach Body lighthvy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johngorman View Post
    Fine, I will do the footwork here on supersaturation and keto diets. I have Duchaine's book here in front of me, so I'll just type and transfer the info here. This shit fascinates me................it's Duchaines 7 day BodyOpus ketogenic diet with supercompensation on the weekend.

    Monday:

    Calories- 10% below maintenance levels.
    Food- all fat and protein sources. NO CARBS!!!
    Activity- muscles will be full today from the carb load over the weekend, so workouts will be best on today. train half your body today (upper body).
    Tricks- Glucose Disposal Agents will speed you ascent into ketosis.
    Aerobics- not recommended because they will effect tuesdays workout negatively. however, aerobics will speed your descent into ketosis if done at 70% or higher max heart rate.
    Mood- you wont be hurting on monday because you will be full of glycogen.

    Tuesday: most uncomfortable day because blood glucose will be around 50 mg/dl.

    Calories- 10% less than maintenance, NO CARBS

    Food types- same as monday

    Activity- train the other half of the body. aerobics afterwards are fine. by mid evening you should be in ketosis.

    Tricks- if your blood glucose reading isnt 60 mg/dl, you can use chromium and vanadyl sulfate with a soluble protein drink to lower levels.

    Wednesday and Thursday: Cruise days of just aerobics.

    Friday: will go through ketosis, post ketosis, and recomposition all in one day.

    Food- 1 -2 hours before your workout (which will be a full body workout to deplete glycogen to very low levels) eat some carbs 100-200 calories, bananas or apples are ideal here. sucrose, fructose and glucose will work together to suit the purpose here.

    Activity- do aerobics in the AM when in ketosis. do a complete body workout (lasts about two hours). i am not going to list the complete workout, it's in the book. it is one monster workout where you deplete every muscle group. you can use your imagination here. i am picturing a ralphing pail myself!

    So basically you train upperbody on monday, lower body tuesday, aerobics the rest of the week, and then friday evening one giant monster workout to train the whole body and deplete glycogen. During the week Mon-Friday you are in ketosis and eating no carbs until right after the giant workout friday evening.

    Friday's Post Workout Eating and into the weekend;

    Stage 1; initial 24 hours of feeding, 12 feedings (one every 2 hours, even while sleeping)
    type foods- glucose, glucose polymers and starches (the real sugary stuff)
    Meals 1-4; drink 2 grams carbs to Lean body mass in kg. drink carb drinks with simple sugars, you can add protein to these.

    Meals 5-8; these should be liquid carbs and solid high glycemic carbs (corn flakes), 1.5 carbs per kg LBMass.

    Meals 9-12; finally some real food! eat .5 grams per lean mass from solid starches and liquid carbs. as usual, add protein to each meal.

    Stage 2; 25-48 hours of feeding, 12 feedings

    type foods- mixed, primarily starches
    Meals 1-4; 1 gram per pound solid carbs

    Meals 5-8; .75 gram per pound of complex carbs, rice, potatoes, pasta, etc. insulin sensitivity is declining in this stage.

    Meals 9-12; .5 gram per pound of liquid sugar carbs to give you a sugar crash and get you ready for your descent into ketosis.

    this should last until sunday evening. start the cycle over on monday.

    from what i gather here is that you can burn a decent amount of fat while in ketosis, and then super saturate your muscles over the weekend. he doesnt go into specifics on how much of the GDA's to use, so that's something that experimenting with a glucometer would tell us. basically the GDA's would shuttle all the nutrients into the muscle without having much if any stored in the fat cell. they would also aid by getting you into ketosis faster (36 hours) instead of the traditional 72 hours.

    personally, if i could just eat shit all weekend (pizza, cake, ice cream) and then be on a ketogenic diet all week i would be in heaven. unfortunately that wont work.

    Duchaine was way ahead of his time. i recommend this book, but be warned- he is one of those guys who is genius but also a quack at the same time. i love it.

    this is it in a small nutshell, and i am too lazy to type up all the small details. if you want those, buy his BodyOpus book.
    Very good book, I read it while on vacation and probably highlighted it more than some of my texts from school lol. Lots of good nuggets of info...

  5. #73
    Behemoth johngorman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lighthvy View Post
    Very good book, I read it while on vacation and probably highlighted it more than some of my texts from school lol. Lots of good nuggets of info...
    definitely for someone who wants to be "extra-ordinary". great stuff, and i plan on running something similar sometime for a few weeks, but with my own keto diet. his is like 70% fat, 30% protein or some crazy shit i cant remember without looking it up. keto nutrition is easy after all, i just want a way to eat as many carbs as possible on the weekends and still get shredded! LOL!

  6. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by johngorman View Post
    definitely for someone who wants to be "extra-ordinary". great stuff, and i plan on running something similar sometime for a few weeks, but with my own keto diet. his is like 70% fat, 30% protein or some crazy shit i cant remember without looking it up. keto nutrition is easy after all, i just want a way to eat as many carbs as possible on the weekends and still get shredded! LOL!
    I hear ya, the thought of fatty beef or a shitload of natty pb sounds just rediculously good to me right now... then the supersaturation is icing on the cake! When I saturated for my last show, I was eating every hour and loved it. Friday was all rice cakes and PB w/ turkey then steak, potato and cheesecake to finish off the day. Best day ever haha...
    Now that i think about it, I spend most of my time fantasizing about food that last week of prep, not the meal after the show lol

  7. #75
    Behemoth johngorman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lighthvy View Post
    I hear ya, the thought of fatty beef or a shitload of natty pb sounds just rediculously good to me right now... then the supersaturation is icing on the cake! When I saturated for my last show, I was eating every hour and loved it. Friday was all rice cakes and PB w/ turkey then steak, potato and cheesecake to finish off the day. Best day ever haha...
    Now that i think about it, I spend most of my time fantasizing about food that last week of prep, not the meal after the show lol
    i am tired of the typical prep. i am sick of regular complex carbs. i am sick of ordinary dieting. this is probably the answer i need to try/learn something new. if i never see another bowl of oatmeal or eggs i will be fine. the more natty pb i eat, the better. hell, i even crave olive oil with my shakes! lol!

    i just wish we had someone on here with experience supersaturating while on keto. oh well, i'll be the guinea pig after my prep i guess.

  8. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by johngorman View Post
    i am tired of the typical prep. i am sick of regular complex carbs. i am sick of ordinary dieting. this is probably the answer i need to try/learn something new. if i never see another bowl of oatmeal or eggs i will be fine. the more natty pb i eat, the better. hell, i even crave olive oil with my shakes! lol!

    i just wish we had someone on here with experience supersaturating while on keto. oh well, i'll be the guinea pig after my prep i guess.
    Haha, I'm still lovin my carbs, but I did get sick of oats. I got around it. Instead of eating oats n eggs in the am, i made a pancake out of em. When I had oats n shakes, i blended them together or made a damn good pudding/ice cream. I posted some food prep stuff on my prep thread if you want to check it out... stick with it. I'd like to see how your guinea pig experiment goes

  9. #77
    Behemoth johngorman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lighthvy View Post
    Haha, I'm still lovin my carbs, but I did get sick of oats. I got around it. Instead of eating oats n eggs in the am, i made a pancake out of em. When I had oats n shakes, i blended them together or made a damn good pudding/ice cream. I posted some food prep stuff on my prep thread if you want to check it out... stick with it. I'd like to see how your guinea pig experiment goes
    i am keeping track of everything, amount of cardio, diet, training, GDA use, glucometer readings, body fat totals and pinch totals for each body part, etc. my first set of readings will be this friday. hopefully i dont binge too hard on the weekends! once the floodgates are opened...............

  10. #78

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    i've read over these threads many times and was wondering would it be beneficial to take prior to postworkout cardio? or just save it for your meal that you have after your cardio is done. I know its recommended to take it prior to morning cardio, just couldnt find this answer.....may have missed it. let me know if you can, thanks.

  11. #79
    Juggernaut KurtyJ99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tipsta View Post
    Not at all lazy. I just see that this is something that is being taken way out of text. They just aid insulin in doing its job better with less effort. Thats it. Pretty simple.
    In fact you will find that youll need to increase your carb intake once these supps are part of you arsenal.

    Why would u have to increase carb intake exactly?
    Gentlemen, you have two choices: Mamma Mia or Jersey Boys.

  12. #80
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BIGSNOR View Post
    i've read over these threads many times and was wondering would it be beneficial to take prior to postworkout cardio? or just save it for your meal that you have after your cardio is done. I know its recommended to take it prior to morning cardio, just couldnt find this answer.....may have missed it. let me know if you can, thanks.
    The workout itself does everything and more to put us in a fat burning mode from using blood sugar and having the liver replenish it as well as exausting its reserves somewhat so insulin has long been out of the equation and blood sugars are somewhat compromised.
    TRAIN HARD AND WIN EASY!!!
    Co-Promoter of the NPC "Royal Palm Classic"

  13. #81
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northman69 View Post
    Why would u have to increase carb intake exactly?

    Since you lessened the insulin threshold youll be able to eat more with the same insulin threshold as previously with lower carbs.

    The impact on insulin is all the body knows when it comes to carbs.

    Never heard of NET carbs? Same as Fibrous veggies. No impact on insulin.
    TRAIN HARD AND WIN EASY!!!
    Co-Promoter of the NPC "Royal Palm Classic"

  14. #82
    Juggernaut KurtyJ99's Avatar
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    My diet is going so good this year, I just started taking slin trol at all of my carb meals, I carb cycle.

    That would be awfully scary to take in more carbs to tell you the truth because I don't wanna mess up what I have going u know?
    Gentlemen, you have two choices: Mamma Mia or Jersey Boys.

  15. #83
    Bro Scientist Tipsta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northman69 View Post
    My diet is going so good this year, I just started taking slin trol at all of my carb meals, I carb cycle.



    That would be awfully scary to take in more carbs to tell you the truth because I don't wanna mess up what I have going u know?
    Dieting fort something or just for yourself? Either way post some pics.

    The amount of carbs is irrelevant as long as you lose the desired amount of weight. I could care less at the actual amount. All I care about is the loss or gain of weight.
    TRAIN HARD AND WIN EASY!!!
    Co-Promoter of the NPC "Royal Palm Classic"

  16. #84
    Juggernaut KurtyJ99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tipsta View Post
    Dieting fort something or just for yourself? Either way post some pics.

    The amount of carbs is irrelevant as long as you lose the desired amount of weight. I could care less at the actual amount. All I care about is the loss or gain of weight.

    The amount surely dictates whether I loose or not...

    I don't have the fastest metabolism ever, but it's pretty descent.

    I'm using a 200 150 100 repeat with sundays no carbs because I don't train that day. So far feeling awesome. I'm about 10 percent bf atm
    Gentlemen, you have two choices: Mamma Mia or Jersey Boys.

  17. #85
    Juggernaut KurtyJ99's Avatar
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    Yea kind of just for myself for right now, goal was to hit 9 bf because I knew if I could hit that then I would Know I had the power to cut down at any time on my own, and I would love to compete after i add 10 lbs more of muscle or so...
    Gentlemen, you have two choices: Mamma Mia or Jersey Boys.

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