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Trainers, Killers and Gurus by Shawn Ray

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  • mayor of bodybuilding
    replied
    Originally posted by Howard View Post

    Once some misguided poor soul decides to "floor it" and drive off the cliff, it's too late.

    Part of what we both love about bodybuilding is the "wild west" crazy side.
    Like me, you have your sensible opinions on what the sport could be.

    However, it's never been too sensible and that keeps it interesting..
    Everyone has their own limits on what they are willing to risk to be thier best! I know plenty of good bodybuilders who are healthy today. They were nit nat6but logical

    Leave a comment:


  • Howard
    replied
    Originally posted by mayor of bodybuilding View Post
    Watched some very interesting videos about Shelby Starnes. Former clients speaking out.
    Once some misguided poor soul decides to "floor it" and drive off the cliff, it's too late.

    Part of what we both love about bodybuilding is the "wild west" crazy side.
    Like me, you have your sensible opinions on what the sport could be.

    However, it's never been too sensible and that keeps it interesting..

    Leave a comment:


  • Howard
    replied
    Originally posted by Beti ona View Post

    Fair enough, but remember that Victor Conte had some of the Olympic top athletes alongside some top bodybuilders at Balco.

    I think these scientists might be interested in bodybuilders, not for money, but for the opportunity to experiment without fear of getting caught.
    Maybe? But without the core base of big $$ pro athletes, I just don't see that happening.

    Leave a comment:


  • Beti ona
    replied
    Originally posted by Howard View Post

    You're missing the point, which was directed at bodybuilding and other pro divisions.

    No question an MD doc can be corrupted with the $$ and "influence" from big time sports.
    The pro contest industry doesn't have the money or backing to corrupt most established docs and scientists.

    This is why pseudo science gurus are the go to guys .
    Most lack the credentials and resume to work in the legit arena.
    Fair enough, but remember that Victor Conte had some of the Olympic top athletes alongside some top bodybuilders at Balco.

    I think these scientists might be interested in bodybuilders, not for money, but for the opportunity to experiment without fear of getting caught.

    Leave a comment:


  • Beti ona
    replied
    Originally posted by mayor of bodybuilding View Post
    Watched some very interesting videos about Shelby Starnes. Former clients speaking out.
    We've had too much going on this in the last few weeks, pretty good info if you ask me, this is better than the bad WWE type entertainment.

    Leave a comment:


  • Howard
    replied
    Originally posted by lifepulse View Post


    Same time, no "established doctors and scientists" really knew CRAP about anabolic steroids, until all of those "pseudo science gurus" pretty much figured it out for them. Reality is, modern medical science has done an abysmal job of ACTUALLY figuring out the science of bodybuilding drugs, bodybuilding training, and bodybuilding nutrition. The "experimental guru on the street", has typically been a full 30 years ahead of the FDA and any other "official" scientific organization. To that end, I'm pretty confident that the vast majority of ACTUAL doctors, would know LESS about most of the stuff that we (as bodybuilders) do, than most of the "pseudo science gurus". Otherwise, we would still be upholding the idea that you should eat 8-10 servings of bread a day, and that anabolic steroids don't actually build muscle.


    Because of how it is established (politically) in this country (and many others), the "official science", is often far behind what the experimenters-on-the-street already know.


    -David
    I agree, but the problem is , there is no legitimate medical rationale for track records or hitting 70 home runs, etc.
    Granted we have the relatively new science of performance enhancement in athletes.
    But most research studies were based on nutrition or strength training.

    The (former) East German track and swimming teams were a DOCUMENTED national effort to win via PED's.
    Plus, we now have numerous TRT and HGH clinics run by legit medical docs.

    However, in elite bodybuilding, the drug use is so extreme, it will never be an accepted part of medical science.
    The amount of test and/or HGH prescribed at an anti-aging clinic is a fraction of what bodybuilders use.
    The only people dealing with those extreme levels are "underground gurus" , operating OUTSIDE of established science or medicine.

    In my observation, elite bodybuilders are no longer drug enhanced...they are drug dependent.

    Leave a comment:


  • lifepulse
    replied
    Originally posted by Howard View Post

    You're missing the point, which was directed at bodybuilding and other pro divisions.

    No question an MD doc can be corrupted with the $$ and "influence" from big time sports.
    The pro contest industry doesn't have the money or backing to corrupt most established docs and scientists.

    This is why pseudo science gurus are the go to guys .
    Most lack the credentials and resume to work in the legit arena.

    Same time, no "established doctors and scientists" really knew CRAP about anabolic steroids, until all of those "pseudo science gurus" pretty much figured it out for them. Reality is, modern medical science has done an abysmal job of ACTUALLY figuring out the science of bodybuilding drugs, bodybuilding training, and bodybuilding nutrition. The "experimental guru on the street", has typically been a full 30 years ahead of the FDA and any other "official" scientific organization. To that end, I'm pretty confident that the vast majority of ACTUAL doctors, would know LESS about most of the stuff that we (as bodybuilders) do, than most of the "pseudo science gurus". Otherwise, we would still be upholding the idea that you should eat 8-10 servings of bread a day, and that anabolic steroids don't actually build muscle.


    Because of how it is established (politically) in this country (and many others), the "official science", is often far behind what the experimenters-on-the-street already know.


    -David

    Leave a comment:


  • Noel Fuller
    replied
    Shawns sunglasses indoors is a classy look

    Leave a comment:


  • mayor of bodybuilding
    replied
    Watched some very interesting videos about Shelby Starnes. Former clients speaking out.

    Leave a comment:


  • Noel Fuller
    replied
    Who?

    Leave a comment:


  • Griff11
    replied
    Originally posted by GeorgeUK View Post
    Does he ever say anything good about anyone?
    No he doesn't

    Leave a comment:


  • Howard
    replied
    Originally posted by GeorgeUK View Post
    Does he ever say anything good about anyone?
    He often speaks favorably of Shawn Ray

    Leave a comment:


  • Howard
    replied
    Originally posted by Beti ona View Post

    Lol, true
    You're missing the point, which was directed at bodybuilding and other pro divisions.

    No question an MD doc can be corrupted with the $$ and "influence" from big time sports.
    The pro contest industry doesn't have the money or backing to corrupt most established docs and scientists.

    This is why pseudo science gurus are the go to guys .
    Most lack the credentials and resume to work in the legit arena.

    Leave a comment:


  • Beti ona
    replied
    Originally posted by Howard View Post
    1. No MD or certified science professional is going to risk their career getting involved in training IFBB pros.
    They likely have an established career in a legitimate field .
    This prohibits them from getting involved in "drug regimes" for pros.

    Mmmh, and the doctors who care the pro sports or national teams that go to the Olympics, what the hell do you think they are doing apart from doping and avoiding tests?

    Doctors and health scientists are just as corruptible as other human beings, and many will want to obtain large salaries and knowledge of sports performance by doing human experiments on athletes.


    3. You can't have a renegade freak show and expect it to attract / involve responsible , wholesome people .
    Lol, true

    Leave a comment:


  • GeorgeUK
    replied
    Does he ever say anything good about anyone?

    Leave a comment:

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