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Bertil Fox released!

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Ron Harris View Post

    She was in love - I seem to recall she moved to Las Vegas to be closer to him.
    Hmmm, what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas?
    I saw a star, reached for it...and MISSED

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by lifepulse View Post


      I used to rent the "Faces of Death" VHS's when I was a kid -- so yeah, you can lump me into that camp. No fucks given. Normal people are boring when they all regurgitate the same thing, sorry boss.


      -David
      I find the actual killing acts to be gross and disturbing.
      But , I'm interested in the psychological insights into their sick minds.

      I saw a show on one crazy fuk who kidnapped young women.
      He kept them locked up in this bunker and raped them .I think he killed them after a few weeks ,but I'm not sure how they recovered the bodies? He got caught after he gave one "severance pay" and released her at a vacant lot.

      At the trial he claimed he was training girls to be good wives and the hand cuffs and restraints were just " kinky jewelry"

      That was one sick fuk .
      I saw a star, reached for it...and MISSED

      Comment


      • #63
        Of course the killing acts are "gross and disturbing" -- so are a lot of other things that human beings do, on a daily basis.


        I'm not at all "excusing" his past, or behaviors. But I also think that a lot of people like to "waive their white-knight flag of moral superiority", whenever they get the chance -- and rarely is that chance "as potent", as when dealing with a murderer.


        Point being, when he did what he did, he was obviously loaded up on androgens -- which we KNOW has large effects on one's psychology and aggression levels (though I'm sure all of the apologists on this board will try to minimize that -- "Hey, *I* didn't kill anybody when *I* took steroids!" -- correct, but you also probably acted like a bigger douchebag than you would have admitted to yourself at the time; lord knows I did.)


        Furthermore -- it's been decades -- and many people DO learn and DO change, and DO feel remorse and regret their stupid "heat of the moment" behavior from 20-30 years prior.


        By no means am I saying "Bertril should be forgiven". I have no idea -- I've never met him, never talked to him, never heard what he has to say on the subject.


        And that's precisely why I think it would be an interesting interview -- as opposed to just "damning him for eternity", as most are inclined to do whenever something "doesn't jive correctly with their self-image of sainthood".


        There have been a whole lot of murderers throughout history -- many of whom you likely voted into power at one point. He's just another to add to the list. Stop with the theatrics, people.


        -David

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by lifepulse View Post
          Of course the killing acts are "gross and disturbing" -- so are a lot of other things that human beings do, on a daily basis.


          I'm not at all "excusing" his past, or behaviors. But I also think that a lot of people like to "waive their white-knight flag of moral superiority", whenever they get the chance -- and rarely is that chance "as potent", as when dealing with a murderer.


          Point being, when he did what he did, he was obviously loaded up on androgens -- which we KNOW has large effects on one's psychology and aggression levels (though I'm sure all of the apologists on this board will try to minimize that -- "Hey, *I* didn't kill anybody when *I* took steroids!" -- correct, but you also probably acted like a bigger douchebag than you would have admitted to yourself at the time; lord knows I did.)


          Furthermore -- it's been decades -- and many people DO learn and DO change, and DO feel remorse and regret their stupid "heat of the moment" behavior from 20-30 years prior.


          By no means am I saying "Bertril should be forgiven". I have no idea -- I've never met him, never talked to him, never heard what he has to say on the subject.


          And that's precisely why I think it would be an interesting interview -- as opposed to just "damning him for eternity", as most are inclined to do whenever something "doesn't jive correctly with their self-image of sainthood".


          There have been a whole lot of murderers throughout history -- many of whom you likely voted into power at one point. He's just another to add to the list. Stop with the theatrics, people.


          -David
          "I'm not at all "excusing" his past, or behaviors. But I also think that a lot of people like to "waive their white-knight flag of moral superiority", whenever they get the chance -- and rarely is that chance "as potent", as when dealing with a murderer."

          What a load of shit.
          You say that you're not excusing his past or actions, but then go on to criticise people that believe its inappropriate to interview for that very reason.
          Just too silly for words.

          "as opposed to just "damning him for eternity", as most are inclined to do whenever something "doesn't jive correctly with their self-image of sainthood".
          So tell me, does your self-image of sainthood involve murdering two women?
          Last edited by ausironman; August 24, 2022, 09:28 PM.

          Comment


          • #65
            I like Robert Sapolsky, he has material about the incompatibility of our justice system with the discoveries of science about human behavior.

            It's hard to deal with because we believe in the religious concept of free will, which has been scientifically demolished.

            Robert says that he doesn't believe in punishment, but he doesn't believe in forgiveness either. Put another way, he doesn't believe someone should be released who is clearly going to be a detriment to others, but he doesn't advocate revenge or torture because that individual didn't choose to act as he did.

            Conviction does not fix the crime or bring the murdered back to life. Nor does prevent it, as centuries of experience throughout the world, in different cultures and times, demonstrate.

            It is a problem that we cannot deal with, at least for the moment. Yeah sure, we can kill the killers, keep doing what we've always done and think we're dealing with the problem, but that hasn't solved anything.
            http://betionastore.es/

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by ausironman View Post

              "I'm not at all "excusing" his past, or behaviors. But I also think that a lot of people like to "waive their white-knight flag of moral superiority", whenever they get the chance -- and rarely is that chance "as potent", as when dealing with a murderer."

              What a load of shit.
              You say that you're not excusing his past or actions, but then go on to criticise people that believe its inappropriate to interview for that very reason.
              Just too silly for words.

              "as opposed to just "damning him for eternity", as most are inclined to do whenever something "doesn't jive correctly with their self-image of sainthood".
              So tell me, does your self-image of sainthood involve murdering two women?

              To answer your question directly -- I don't have a "self-image of sainthood" -- I know I'm fucked up, in my own ways -- and I naturally assume that you, too, are fucked up YOUR own ways -- because you're a human being, and ALL human beings are fucked up, in their own unique ways. That's precisely what makes us human -- as Jesus, Lao Tzu, and pretty much every other "great thinker throughout history", has pointed out.


              There is a difference between "criticizing a general tendency for people to think of themselves as morally superior" -- vs. moralizing about those people, specifically. I don't know anything about you. I don't know your name. I don't know what you did last night. I don't know who you have, or have not, raped -- or murdered. I literally don't know ANY of that, about you, specifically. All I know about you, specifically -- is that you typed your opinions out on a forum.


              I ALSO don't know Bertil personally -- besides what the media has told me. And I am NOT inclined to trust media -- I have found, over the years, that it is abysmally inaccurate most of the time -- and does nothing but feed the machine of the moralizing white-knighting that you seem to be a fan of, and committed to. Good for you, I guess? Most murderers in history have had the exact same attitude that you do -- and that much is proven historical fact, so no, I don't really care to debate it -- I would rather refer you to a history book, and wish you the best of luck.


              I'm sorry my stance angered you so much -- but end of the day, I'm not really sorry -- because, again, I don't know you, and could literally care less about you. You're just another person posting on a bodybuilding board, brimming with self-righteousness. Not my first rodeo, sir.


              -David

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by Beti ona View Post
                I like Robert Sapolsky, he has material about the incompatibility of our justice system with the discoveries of science about human behavior.

                It's hard to deal with because we believe in the religious concept of free will, which has been scientifically demolished.

                Robert says that he doesn't believe in punishment, but he doesn't believe in forgiveness either. Put another way, he doesn't believe someone should be released who is clearly going to be a detriment to others, but he doesn't advocate revenge or torture because that individual didn't choose to act as he did.

                Conviction does not fix the crime or bring the murdered back to life. Nor does prevent it, as centuries of experience throughout the world, in different cultures and times, demonstrate.

                It is a problem that we cannot deal with, at least for the moment. Yeah sure, we can kill the killers, keep doing what we've always done and think we're dealing with the problem, but that hasn't solved anything.

                Careful; Beti -- you might make asurionman blow a cognitive gasket with your "overly deep thoughts and science".



                -David

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Beti ona View Post
                  I like Robert Sapolsky, he has material about the incompatibility of our justice system with the discoveries of science about human behavior.

                  It's hard to deal with because we believe in the religious concept of free will, which has been scientifically demolished.

                  Robert says that he doesn't believe in punishment, but he doesn't believe in forgiveness either. Put another way, he doesn't believe someone should be released who is clearly going to be a detriment to others, but he doesn't advocate revenge or torture because that individual didn't choose to act as he did.

                  Conviction does not fix the crime or bring the murdered back to life. Nor does prevent it, as centuries of experience throughout the world, in different cultures and times, demonstrate.

                  It is a problem that we cannot deal with, at least for the moment. Yeah sure, we can kill the killers, keep doing what we've always done and think we're dealing with the problem, but that hasn't solved anything.
                  So how does he suggest society deals with killers if he is saying that he doesnt believe in punishment and conviction doesnt fix the crime?
                  How would you suggest society deal with someone like a Craig Titus, for example?

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by ausironman View Post

                    So how does he suggest society deals with killers if he is saying that he doesnt believe in punishment and conviction doesnt fix the crime?
                    How would you suggest society deal with someone like a Craig Titus, for example?
                    Ask Robert Sapolsky, he has been studying this problem of violence and the ineffectiveness of justice systems. In fact, modern science is incompatible with the ideals that emerged in the Middle Ages or the Enlightenment, which is when our democratic states or republics emerged.

                    He would say that Graig should not be free if he is a danger to other individuals, just that.

                    Revenge feels satisfying, but it doesn't solve the problem. Come on, you're not so stupid that you don't understand this.
                    http://betionastore.es/

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Love all these academics that point out of these issues, but offer no real solutions

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        The problem is that there are no quick and easy solutions to serious and complex problems. Scientifically we are in the early stages of understanding some things, but even if we understood everything about human behavior, the application of these solutions would face 2 barriers: the amount of resources and the ethical problem of this type of intervention. Neither society nor current systems and institutions are prepared for these changes. Scientists only discover things, they have no power to implement solutions.

                        As more scientists delve into this researchs and this knowledge spreads to a larger audience, perhaps in a few decades we may see progress in this direction.


                        http://betionastore.es/

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                        • #72
                          Lex Talionis works for me

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            The man was sentenced to hang. I'd say he got a break with life in prison.

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