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Layne Norton

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  • Hey Layne. I agree with you on the whole concept of pre-contest dieting, but i was wondering what your thoughts were on why every bodybuilder out there does the typical carb up and water depletion. I mean I have the pre-contest bible and most of the pro's in there say they cut their water a few days before. I read that johnny jackson cuts his water the tuesday before and has diet coke from wednesday till the day of the show, lol. Some of those diets and tricks in there are crazy! but they ARE pros and they still look good even though they cut water and all this other crazy stuff. Do think they can get away with cutting water so much because of all the chemicals they take compensates for the water loss?? Do you think bodybuilders really cut water or do they just say they do on paper?? I'm just curious to see what your thoughts are. Thanks

    Comment


    • Originally posted by natedogg View Post
      Hey Layne. I agree with you on the whole concept of pre-contest dieting, but i was wondering what your thoughts were on why every bodybuilder out there does the typical carb up and water depletion. I mean I have the pre-contest bible and most of the pro's in there say they cut their water a few days before. I read that johnny jackson cuts his water the tuesday before and has diet coke from wednesday till the day of the show, lol. Some of those diets and tricks in there are crazy! but they ARE pros and they still look good even though they cut water and all this other crazy stuff. Do think they can get away with cutting water so much because of all the chemicals they take compensates for the water loss?? Do you think bodybuilders really cut water or do they just say they do on paper?? I'm just curious to see what your thoughts are. Thanks
      steroids allow you to retain more water within the cell so even if you deplete the hell out of yourself you still have some fullness. What is the knock on natural bodybuilders... they look 'stringy' onstage.

      Just because everyone does it doesn't mean it's right. 600 years ago everyone knew the world was flat save the exclusive few who actually knew science.

      -Layne
      BioLayne LLC
      PhD, Nutritional Sciences
      Scivation Athlete
      MD Columnist
      Website

      Comment


      • Originally posted by crou View Post
        Yes but I thought it was weird and unusual that he said to just keep everything the same. He told me to stop training tuesday, cut my water from my usual 2+ gallons a day to 3/4 gallon on Thursday, 1/2 gallon Friday, and sip water on the show day. He said to have a sweet potato before pre-judging and sweet potato/steak between pre-judging and the night show. I know that I have used him for 18 weeks but im just really nervous and I am coming to you for help bc you are very knowledgable. Please Layne help a brother out.
        I am hesitant to give you advice honestly because if you don't look good onstage I don't want to be blamed when there were 1000 other variables going on that I couldn't control. I'm sorry bro, that's what people pay me for... to plan out everything and control every detail... I can't do that for you when you've been doing something completely different your entire prep. Plus I respect Earl and I do NOT want to go behind his back. I'm not trying to be a jerk but i'm in grad school, I gotta make a living and I put A TON of info out there for free. You know I don't agree with cutting water and I gave my thoughts on how to do the final week with a keto diet during my interview with dave.

        I hope I don't seem like a jerk but at some point it's just not fair to me bro. I'm getting over 150 emails & messages per day plus trying to answer questions on here, plus my grad school load & research, asking me to do your final week for you when you KNOW I don't believe in cutting water and I've already put all this info out there for FREE, I just don't think that's fair to me.

        Maybe i'm being hypersensitive.
        BioLayne LLC
        PhD, Nutritional Sciences
        Scivation Athlete
        MD Columnist
        Website

        Comment


        • Originally posted by jerryjuice View Post
          Hey Layne,
          Being natural, I have become a huge fan of yours and have been following you through your videoseries and forums. I am looking to finally compete next fall 08 sometime in an amateur show here in Canada and am treating this winter/early spring as my first real "offseason"...legs are a huge priority.
          Would you mind taking a quick look at my leg routine for this fall/winter bulk and identify any GLARING problems. I respect that you dont have much time but anything that you can identify that jumps out as a prob would be appreciated my friend.Traditionally i have done legs once a week on saturdays with the following two routines interchanging each week. I would like to keep these two routines on the saturday and add in another leg day on Wed (usually one of my two off days). With my increased calories I think it should be fine. Here it is...any critique, changes, variation in reps..etc please let me know...im treating the saturday as more of a heavier day and wed focusing on quads/hams with high rep/high intensity day. I had read that incorporating the second day for you had worked and was not detrimental to your leg development.

          SATURDAY (interchanging between a and b everyother week)
          A) Standing Calve Raise 4x20
          Leg Press Calve extentions 4x20
          Sitting Donkey Calve 4x20
          Squats 4x5 3x1 (pyramiding heavy to lighter on the singles)
          Leg Press 4x10
          1 Leg Quad Exten. 4x12
          Lying Ham Curl 4x12

          b) Standing Calve Raise 4x20
          Leg press Calve Extentions 4x20
          Sitting donkey Calve 4x20
          1 Leg Quad Extentions 4x12
          Lying Hamstring Curls 4x12
          Squats 4x12
          Leg Press 4x10

          WEDNESDAY (my new day)

          Standing Calve Raises 4x10
          Leg Press Calves 4x10
          Sitting Donkey Calve 4x10
          Front Squats 5x20
          Quad Extentions 5x20
          SL Dlifts 5x20
          Hamstring Curls 5x20
          thanks for the compliments man. I think it looks ok but honestly i'd use more of a rep scheme variety http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/layne45.htm I'd also watch my webcast where I talk about my training http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/insidethelife.htm

          I would also include more hamstring work... & i would not be doing 20 reps on stiff legged deads... I just don't think high rep deadlifting is smart

          good luck
          BioLayne LLC
          PhD, Nutritional Sciences
          Scivation Athlete
          MD Columnist
          Website

          Comment


          • Originally posted by str8flexed View Post
            I am hesitant to give you advice honestly because if you don't look good onstage I don't want to be blamed when there were 1000 other variables going on that I couldn't control. I'm sorry bro, that's what people pay me for... to plan out everything and control every detail... I can't do that for you when you've been doing something completely different your entire prep. Plus I respect Earl and I do NOT want to go behind his back. I'm not trying to be a jerk but i'm in grad school, I gotta make a living and I put A TON of info out there for free. You know I don't agree with cutting water and I gave my thoughts on how to do the final week with a keto diet during my interview with dave.

            I hope I don't seem like a jerk but at some point it's just not fair to me bro. I'm getting over 150 emails & messages per day plus trying to answer questions on here, plus my grad school load & research, asking me to do your final week for you when you KNOW I don't believe in cutting water and I've already put all this info out there for FREE, I just don't think that's fair to me.

            Maybe i'm being hypersensitive.
            dude your not hypersensitive...just remember what it feels like when all you see in the mirror is a body that isnt ready that has to step on stage (even though it is ready, but you are in a very crappy low carb 2 weeks out mood) in a speedo, and all you want is that magic piece of information, or supplement, or training technique or peak week miracle that will make it all ok when you step on stage...shyt when I was plugging you for info my morals and integrity weren't even floating around in my head...I feel bad now and apologized after the fact, but back then I just wanted to suck your brain dry and get some reassurance lol....man...that first contest is rough mentally....but anyway, I'm just saying I don't think most people 1-4 weeks out are in the right frame of mind to consider how much they might be inconveniencing you, not that it makes it right, but I always see how it pisses you off when people are inconsiderate, and I just wanted to share a little perspective...
            Eric Helms Controlled Labs Athlete NASM CPT & PES
            http://www.3dmusclejourney.com/

            Comment


            • thanks for taking the time to answer my question layne! I will vary rep schemes and rewatch your workouts on the forums/youtube...take care

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Quelly View Post
                dude your not hypersensitive...just remember what it feels like when all you see in the mirror is a body that isnt ready that has to step on stage (even though it is ready, but you are in a very crappy low carb 2 weeks out mood) in a speedo, and all you want is that magic piece of information, or supplement, or training technique or peak week miracle that will make it all ok when you step on stage...shyt when I was plugging you for info my morals and integrity weren't even floating around in my head...I feel bad now and apologized after the fact, but back then I just wanted to suck your brain dry and get some reassurance lol....man...that first contest is rough mentally....but anyway, I'm just saying I don't think most people 1-4 weeks out are in the right frame of mind to consider how much they might be inconveniencing you, not that it makes it right, but I always see how it pisses you off when people are inconsiderate, and I just wanted to share a little perspective...
                oh I'm not mad at all or anything like that. I just have to draw a line somewhere. I've put all this info out there for free I KNOW it hurts my business. How many people have used my precontest diet with success? I know it has to be around the thousands. I could have kept that to myself but I like hearing people say my stuff helped them so I do it. At times it does get tiring when people continue to ask questions than I have covered extensively in all my free info I have out there. People want me to spoon feed them info and frankly, that's where I draw the line. I'm not mad at crou and I hope he understands my position.
                BioLayne LLC
                PhD, Nutritional Sciences
                Scivation Athlete
                MD Columnist
                Website

                Comment


                • Originally posted by str8flexed View Post
                  i'm sorry but this is the typical peak week crap that every 'trainer' gives their client... it's like they take it off a cookie cutter conveyer belt.

                  1) if you stop training on wednesday your body has NO REASON TO HOLD ONTO ALL THAT GLUCOSE THAT YOU ARE GOING TO BE LOADING ON THURSDAY AND FRIDAY AND IT ENDS UP IN THE SUBCUTANEOUS TISSUE.

                  2) if you are going to load at all, the loading should be done when you are working out hard, earlier in the week,

                  3) you should never stop working out, light circuit training on thursday and friday will not impair your recovery or make you sore but will help retain the glucose within the cell

                  4) cutting sodium is just flat out dumb, listen to part one of my debate with **** ******* on MD radio. Essentially cutting sodium does nothing to help you. Your body is perfect at conserving sodium. If you cut it out totally your body will just stop excreting it and reabsorb everything. Only to reabsorb sodium it needs to also reabsorb water, but now since your blood pressure is reduced from sodium depletion, you don't have the pressure to keep the reabsorbed water in the vascular system and it goes where? the subcutaneous layer.

                  don't even get me started on the idiocy of cutting water.

                  I hate to sound like i'm ripping on your trainer but he is just giving you the same regurgitated crap that 99% of 'trainers' give their people. It's the reason you hear 99% of people at shows say "I looked so much better the week before or the day after"

                  -Layne
                  agree , either your in contest shape doing your homework , or your not and now ur paying for it ,

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by str8flexed View Post
                    oh I'm not mad at all or anything like that. I just have to draw a line somewhere. I've put all this info out there for free I KNOW it hurts my business. How many people have used my precontest diet with success? I know it has to be around the thousands. I could have kept that to myself but I like hearing people say my stuff helped them so I do it. At times it does get tiring when people continue to ask questions than I have covered extensively in all my free info I have out there. People want me to spoon feed them info and frankly, that's where I draw the line. I'm not mad at crou and I hope he understands my position.
                    totally understandable, and I hope you know I am one of the thousands who had great success with your plan...if one has the determination its excellent, I was very pleased coming in as one of the leanest competitors in both a tested local show and a NPC national qualifier for my first go(now I just need to actually build something worthy of cutting up!)....ok now new topic new direction

                    Since the palumbo layne debates I've been looking at both your guys' diet plans and nutritional styles and comparing contrasting etc....and I can see merit to both contest prep plans, and they both are well thought out...but in terms of offseason diets I am curious on your thoughts since I am only familiar with your contest prep techniques...and to be clear I am not looking for an individualized plan and I certainly hope this isnt info that youve put out there before...I am just looking for your thoughts on Palumbo's off season methods.

                    Palumbo advocates a 1.25-1.5g/lb protein, 1-1.5g/lb cho, and .75g/lb fat diet with an emphasis on healthy fats and quality protein for an offseason growth phase with minimal fat gains, also keeping the majority of carbs around the workout...what do you think of this? If still in a sufficient caloric surplus, and getting enough cho to fuel workouts and replenish glycogen stores, is there any downside to keeping cho this low on a bulk, and why?
                    Eric Helms Controlled Labs Athlete NASM CPT & PES
                    http://www.3dmusclejourney.com/

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by natedogg View Post
                      Hey Layne. I agree with you on the whole concept of pre-contest dieting, but i was wondering what your thoughts were on why every bodybuilder out there does the typical carb up and water depletion. I mean I have the pre-contest bible and most of the pro's in there say they cut their water a few days before. I read that johnny jackson cuts his water the tuesday before and has diet coke from wednesday till the day of the show, lol. Some of those diets and tricks in there are crazy! but they ARE pros and they still look good even though they cut water and all this other crazy stuff. Do think they can get away with cutting water so much because of all the chemicals they take compensates for the water loss?? Do you think bodybuilders really cut water or do they just say they do on paper?? I'm just curious to see what your thoughts are. Thanks
                      One thing Layne has not adressed is ALDACTONE. Aldactone is not really a diuretic but a hormone inhibitor. It works by suppressing aldosterone which then in return will give a bodybuilder the abilty to drop water or sodium without the fear of Aldosterone release. What he did explain is the Osmotic Ability steroids produce. So remember guys take what you read when it comes to anabolic contest prep and THROW IT AWAY!
                      TRAIN HARD AND WIN EASY!!!
                      Co-Promoter of the NPC "Royal Palm Classic"

                      Comment


                      • I believe I addressed diuretics earlier, but thanks for covering aldactone in detail. Very correct
                        BioLayne LLC
                        PhD, Nutritional Sciences
                        Scivation Athlete
                        MD Columnist
                        Website

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by str8flexed View Post
                          I believe I addressed diuretics earlier, but thanks for covering aldactone in detail. Very correct
                          You are very welcome! Id like to say I'm sorry if I disrespected you in any way with any of my posts. You are a very valuble asset to all including Myself!
                          TRAIN HARD AND WIN EASY!!!
                          Co-Promoter of the NPC "Royal Palm Classic"

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by str8flexed View Post
                            oh I'm not mad at all or anything like that. I just have to draw a line somewhere. I've put all this info out there for free I KNOW it hurts my business. How many people have used my precontest diet with success? I know it has to be around the thousands. I could have kept that to myself but I like hearing people say my stuff helped them so I do it. At times it does get tiring when people continue to ask questions than I have covered extensively in all my free info I have out there. People want me to spoon feed them info and frankly, that's where I draw the line. I'm not mad at crou and I hope he understands my position.
                            Damn Layne, a little condescending? Look, Im sorry that I offended you but I am just getting really really nervous about this. Its my first show ever and I'm just so worried that I'm going to fuck everything up. I mean don't you remember being scared and worried? I wasn't asking you to hold my hand and walk me onstage, just to give me some advice about my carbs in the final week. I dont want to look flat and shitty. I have been through hell for 18 weeks of this damn diet eating only protein powder and 2 half cups of oatmeal a day. I feel like I'm going crazy. Cut me some slack.
                            NGA Pro Bodybuilder

                            Comment


                            • Bro, you don't think I've been through hell before? I've been through a 42 week diet. I was not trying to be condescending at all. I'm trying to make you understand. I know you don't want to fuck things up man, but I have no idea what all you've been doing to this point, and how am I supposed to give you detailed info if you've been doing something else your entire contest prep. I have put all this FREE info out there man. And I have previously addressed all your questions bro. You know I don't believe in cutting water or sodium. You know I don't think you should do a big heavy carb load if you are on a keto diet. what more do you want me to tell you?

                              You didn't offend me. I was just trying to make you understand my point of view.
                              BioLayne LLC
                              PhD, Nutritional Sciences
                              Scivation Athlete
                              MD Columnist
                              Website

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by crou View Post
                                Damn Layne, a little condescending? Look, Im sorry that I offended you but I am just getting really really nervous about this. Its my first show ever and I'm just so worried that I'm going to fuck everything up. I mean don't you remember being scared and worried? I wasn't asking you to hold my hand and walk me onstage, just to give me some advice about my carbs in the final week. I dont want to look flat and shitty. I have been through hell for 18 weeks of this damn diet eating only protein powder and 2 half cups of oatmeal a day. I feel like I'm going crazy. Cut me some slack.
                                listen to your trainer thats what you paid him for.. getting anyone else's advice at this point would prolly do more harm then good

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